ChanServ changed the topic of #wayland to: https://wayland.freedesktop.org | Discussion about the Wayland protocol and its implementations, plus libinput | register your nick to speak
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<cheako> 4min video showcasing wonky FPS.
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<kennylevinsen> cheako: #gnome-shell on irc.gnome.org
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<cheako> or https://matrix.to/#/#gnome-shell:gnome.org
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<cheako> There are only like 300ppl there though, the main channel has a thousand.
<kennylevinsen> so?
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<cheako> What should I tell them? Was I any good at expressing what the problem is? I'm autistic, so it's unnatural for me.
<kennylevinsen> don't worry about autism. Just say that you're experiencing unexpected behavior, describe the behavior and share the video link, and ask for advice.
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<cheako> Each time someone makes a comment about my situation, I learn something about how it's presented... I think it's a compositor bug... Here is a #wayland question, what event would an X11 app get when it's "zoomed out" like that?
<cheako> I think the only change should be the render path, it goes from by-passing the compositor to being textured.
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<cheako> ...There is a tool for that:
<cheako> I didn't do a super job at isolating just the events from the "event". https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/lfhSv22a/xev.txt
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<kennylevinsen> direct scanout (compositor bypass) and composition is handled transparently by the compositor whenever possible/appropriate (the stars have to align for it to be possible), the client is not informed of this
<MrCooper> cheako: is that with vsync enabled or disabled in the game?
<cheako> enabled, I left that at the default.
<cheako> I tried to show the refresh was 60hz, but it's too bury to read.
<cheako> Could be a 1/2 VS 1/10th thing, the "modes" do seem to fall into specific frame rates.
<cheako> Though that would be difficult to get an accurate handle on, the framerate is never "stable".
<cheako> Usually only +-0.7fps.
<cheako> ...as a guess.
<MrCooper> the gnome-shell UI getting bogged down by a slow client is essentially https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/issues/1162 ; one element of it could be considered a mutter bug, not one which can be fixed overnight though
<MrCooper> per https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/issues/1162#note_790148 though, completely solving that will also require the radeonsi driver to support EGL_IMG_context_priority
<MrCooper> the game frame time varying so much is weird, I guess it could be affected by how mutter sends frame / buffer release events
<cheako> If it's just the game is taking too long to render, that I could fix. What bothers me about that is the randomness is still unexplained. The scene is not dynamic enough for a jump from/to 7-27fps. The random value is sampled when the game loses full-screen and is static until another blur like event. If you just focus the game, the FPS doesn't change noticeably, even if it is no-longer obscured by the previous focus.
<cheako> MrCooper++
<MrCooper> I have no explanation for the big variance in game frame times
<cheako> I can confirm the just lowering the detail removes the randomness, I can get 47 to 32FPS consistently depending on the options chosen.
<cheako> So I just do the normal gamer thing of weighing detail over beauty and leave everything else as a thought exercise. If you need me todo some testing, I'll be around.
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<cheako> Sign, that's not it. Because it's so unpredictable, you can get setups that work until they don't. I thought I had everything back to Ultra expect ground tessellation and textures, but then I had to put everything back to Enhanced... Now I've repeated tests that show even that's not good enough.
<cheako> *Sigh
<MrCooper> my first suspect for that would be the game itself or possibly Mesa
<cheako> The devs have posted Linux fixes in changelogs, but they don't have any support portal... Just a public discord, that's actually how I found out that the bug I'm really working on was because of my awful frame rates.
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<wlb> weston Merge request !773 opened by () libweston: fix paint node color invariant https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston/-/merge_requests/773 [Core compositor]
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<pq> weston rc1 day tomorrow, right?
<kennylevinsen> did we want this release round to warn of future launcher deprecation (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston/-/issues/488) or should we wait for next round given the stall on the openembedded side of things
<pq> I see no problem in deprecating. The removal should consider OE though.
<kennylevinsen> makes sense
<cheako> MrCooper: I am shocked to learn I'm running Xorg, at least I don't think xwayland would give `"GLAMOR Textured Video"` as a xv adaptor.
<cheako> That was the final thing where I was convinced what I was seeing everywhere else was right.
<wlb> weston Merge request !774 opened by () [trivial] libweston: fix weston_view::geometry.parent comment https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston/-/merge_requests/774 [Core compositor], [Good for new contributors]
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<wlb> weston Merge request !775 opened by () meson: Print deprecation warning for weston-launch https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston/-/merge_requests/775
<pq> cheako, I do get "glamor textured video" from Xwayland.
<cheako> facepalm.
<pq> hmm, but not in the capitalization you spelled in, it's all lower-case here
<pq> I get your spelling of it under Xorg
<cheako> I have a Xorg.1.log.old from Jan 22 and that was when I updated my bios and Xorg.1.log so, I'm still convinced I'm running Xorg.
<pq> look at your process tree, that would be a very strong indication as well
<pq> maybe your graphical login runs on Xorg? That does not need to match the desktop session wayland vs. x11.
<cheako> What's the name of a Wayland only program I may have installed?
<cheako> I'm sure it's Xorg, I just need to prove it logically somehow.
<pq> wayland-info would be one, but dunno if you have it installed
<pq> looking at the process hierarchy would tell you too: ps auxw -H
<cheako> "foot"
<cheako> err: wayland.c:1111: failed to connect to wayland; no compositor running?
<cheako> I'll be over at #dri-devel where I belong.
<pq> good luck :-)
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<Company> swick, pq: Do you know any resources (I prefer videos, but I'll take anything) that explain iccmax in detail and how it's different from iccv4 ?
<pq> Company, I don't know of any.
<Company> I understand *why* it exists, but not *how* it works
<pq> I haven't seen any FOSS implementation of iccmax yet, which means I'm not interested.
<Company> I mostly want to understand the color math behind it and think about API design that can be forward compatible to ICCMAX
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<swick> Company: it's backwards compatible for starters and there is a few white papers from the ICC
<swick> it's kind of hard to point at a single thing
<swick> there is encoding for more paramatric functions which work for HDR stuff
<swick> there is a calculator element which allows the perceptual transform to be defined dynamically with external parameters
<swick> you can define a subset of ICC features and how it should be used for a certain use case
<swick> there also is a way to define a different perceptual profile connection space which is handy for HDR
<smurray> I noticed that weston.git on github isn't up to date with gitlab.fd.org, is that an oversight or a planned process change?
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<wlb> weston Merge request !776 opened by () tests: give name for the test-shell background https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston/-/merge_requests/776 [Testing]
<daniels> smurray: it's an oversight, being rectified atm
<daniels> smurray: but also, use gitlab.fd.o as canonical for everything :) the others are just read-only mirrors ...
<daniels> (GitHub is really just there so people have something to fork their own repos from)
<smurray> daniels: okay, thanks
<smurray> daniels: probably not easily fixable, but googling "weston git" gives the github location as the first hit
<daniels> smurray: blah
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<JPEW> For some inexpliciable reason, I thought that weston would try to "time" a surface frame callback based on the historical render time of the application so that the new surface frame would arrive right before the next vsync.... I can't seem to find this in the code; it looks like it sends the frame callback immediately after each repaint
<JPEW> Maybe it used to do this and no longer does, or I just made it up?
<kennylevinsen> weston doesn't do anything adaptive, but it does not merely fire the frame callback after repaint: https://www.collabora.com/about-us/blog/2015/02/12/weston-repaint-scheduling/
<kennylevinsen> ... that's from 2015. now I feel old.
<kennylevinsen> uh, I meant they do not fire after vsync - they do fire afre repaint, but this is delayed from vsync.
<daniels> Mutter does that exact adaptive thing you're talking about - it's really cool
<daniels> Weston's, as noted, is a configurable-but-fixed offset backwards from next vbl
<JPEW> Got it. The reason I ask is that we have an application that does content specific limiting on rendering (e.g. if the content only updates every 20ms, it will not render any faster than that), but this appears to interact badly with waiting for the frame callback
<JPEW> e.g. we can't get an actual 20ms update rate for some reason. I originally though that the (non-existent) adaptive frame timing algorithm was confused by our extra sleeping
<MrCooper> something like that shouldn't be based on frame events, yeah
<MrCooper> frame events are for clients who want to rely on the compositor telling them when to draw a new frame
<JPEW> I think what we want is to render our content at the rate it updates, but not faster than vsync.... is there a better way to do that?
<MrCooper> JPEW: what does "can't get an actual 20ms update rate" mean exactly? Literally speaking, that's only possible if the refresh rate is (a multiple of) 50 Hz
<JPEW> MrCooper: Hmm, that is a good question. I'm unfortunately the go-between on this one, so let me ask.....
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<wlb> weston Merge request !777 opened by () clients/simple-dmabuf-feedback: do not use buffer before compositor's response https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston/-/merge_requests/777
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