#dri-devel on 2021-07-30 — irc logs at oftc.irclog.whitequark.org

2021-07-26 22:56 ChanServ changed the topic of #dri-devel to: <ajax> nothing involved with X should ever be unable to find a bar

00:00 <imirkin_> where it does the texture 4x, with the "other" lanes masked out each time

00:00 <imirkin_> [if it doesn't fall into what's implicitly supported by the "native" textureGrad opcode]

00:00 <graphitemaster> On NV it's not even necessary to emit textureGrad because the TSC does have support to change the derivatives used, so this is just a missed optimization of nouveau.

00:03 <imirkin_> ok, but like ... heh

00:03 <imirkin_> i can only imagine the disaster it will cause on r600

00:04 <graphitemaster> I mean if I sketched out a proposal it would basically be, drivers need a way to list what the default derivatives are for implicit lod samplers, and if it can be changed, mesa needs to honor glHint unconditionally regardless of the hardware, taking care to emulate the behavior in software (with textureGrad) if the hardware does not support it, and then NIR needs lower passes to find and remove explicit textureGrad and textureLod

00:04 <graphitemaster> uses that happen to match what the hardware is currently configured as, including coarse derivatives (quad share hack in that article I linked) so that we have consistency with D3D even on hardware that only has Fine derivatives.

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00:10 <graphitemaster> This then makes GL_NICEST = Fine, GL_FASTEST = Coarse, and GL_DONT_CARE = What is Mesa default (conveniently also what is GL default). I suppose we could argue that on hardware with only Fine derivatives, emulating Coarse when GL_FASTEST wouldn't actually be the fastest, but that article I linked that emulates Coarse with Fine does so without any measurable overhead.

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01:17 <jekstrand> graphitemaster: At least on Intel, I know of no way to change implicit LOD behavior

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01:42 <mareko> "without any measurable overhead" - well that's a bold statement

01:42 <agd5f> JoshuaAshton, yeah, trying to find the right business unit rep verify that with

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02:04 <graphitemaster> jekstrand, SAMPLER_STATE: "Allow low quality LOD calculation" (dword 3, bit 24), it looks like it interacts with dword 0, bit 0 "Lod Algorithm" which can be set to LEGACY or EWA (This is for anisotropic filtering). So at least Xe has these bits, that's the doc I'm reading, check pages 871 (888 in the PDF), and 876 (894 in the PDF), it looks like when Allow low quality LOD calculation is set, the sampler uses coarse, while when

02:04 <graphitemaster> it's unset it uses fine.

02:04 <graphitemaster> https://01.org/sites/default/files/documentation/intel-gfx-prm-osrc-dg1-vol02d-commandreference-structures.pdf

02:06 <graphitemaster> I dunno if older Intel iGPUs have it, hard to find those documents :P

02:07 <graphitemaster> You can also pick the actual linear filtering quality in here too, that's kind of neat.

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02:09 <mareko> AMD hasn't used coarse derivatives for implicit LOD since 2011 GPUs at least

02:09 <mareko> past AMD hw had the option to use coarse derivatives there, but it was just dark silicon

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02:11 <graphitemaster> So AMD GPUs are not D3D spec compliant then?

02:11 <graphitemaster> Or I suppose the D3D driver has to do some hacky stuff to emulate coarse derivatives for LOD.

02:12 <mareko> non-compliant? yes; emulation? no

02:13 <mareko> exceptions are given for non-compliance for both D3D and GL

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02:28 <mareko> specs sometimes go the other way and are changed to match what the drivers do

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02:41 <graphitemaster> That's a bit frustrating. These minor quirks really ought to be defined.

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05:58 <airlied> mlankhorst: all merged thanks!

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07:23 <tomeu> anholt_: this device went away and the retry logic seemed to have trouble retaking after: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/jobs/12338163

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07:26 <airlied> agd5f: btw git grep " $" drivers/gpu/drm/amd is showing a few files sneaking in with trailing whitespace

07:34 <JTL> airlied: okay to ask amdgpu question here?

07:40 <airlied> JTL: okay to ask, but I probably won't be here to answer (gotta run), will check later, agd5f is the person to ask these things usually

07:40 <JTL> fair

07:42 <JTL> for amdgpu, how to determine which DCE version is used for a GPU?

07:42 <JTL> (as for why, studying said driver code for a project)

07:47 <MrCooper> JTL: for VI or older, "git grep 'amdgpu_device_ip_block_add.*dce_v[0-9]' drivers/gpu/drm/amd/amdgpu" is a good start

07:48 <MrCooper> for newer, need to search under drivers/gpu/drm/amd/display/

07:49 <JTL> ah

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11:17 <jekstrand> graphitemaster: Yes, that bit exists. I don't think it's just a derivative control bit.

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12:23 <agd5f> JTL, it's statically mapped in the driver since there are a bunch of DCE/DCN versions. See the paths MrCooper mentioned

12:24 <JTL> I saw

12:24 <JTL> Think I found what I'm looking for now

12:24 <JTL> Cheers

12:37 <agd5f> how does on delete a personal project on gitlab? Or better yet, how do you change it from private to public. It won't let me change it to public in the settings.

12:38 <bnieuwenhuizen> go to project -> settings -> general -> advanced -> delete project

12:38 <agd5f> got it. thanks

12:38 <bnieuwenhuizen> not sure what would be up with visibility assuming you got the dropdown box

12:39 <pq> could the "parent" level be private?

12:39 <agd5f> I get the drop down, but it wouldn't drop down

12:58 <agd5f> MrCooper, https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/driver/xf86-video-amdgpu/-/merge_requests/63

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13:48 <alyssa> dschuermann: cwabbott: ooo, ssa ra talk, spicy

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15:15 <cwabbott> alyssa: you're attending the workshop, right?

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15:24 <alyssa> cwabbott: I'd like to! let me see what my class schedule is like

15:25 <alyssa> There are *gasp* in person classes this fall...

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16:20 <alyssa> cwabbott: Alright, I'll be there 😄

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16:39 <alyssa> "The recommended setup is using X11 with Chrome/Chromium, as this is the most stable."

16:39 <alyssa> 😯

16:46 <graphitemaster> My favorite way of running chrome is chromium --user-data-dir=/tmp and then rebooting immediately afterwards to clean myself of the google.

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16:54 <alyssa> graphitemaster: I used to do that but then I got vaccinated 🙃

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17:00 <graphitemaster> There's a vaccine for google?

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17:08 <imirkin_> eventually you learn to stop worrying and love the google

17:09 <alyssa> 🤖

17:10 <DrNick> block all ads and ignore the google

17:13 <graphitemaster> Or, click on all ads and confuse the Google.

17:14 <graphitemaster> What if there was a browser extension that just mixed in other's Google searches with your own, we could use their algorithms against them.

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18:09 <mattst88> cwabbott, alyssa: I'm interested in this SSA RA talk/workshop. is this going to be at XDC?

18:09 <mattst88> I guess I'm missing some context

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18:17 <danylo> mattst88: https://indico.freedesktop.org/event/1/contributions/1/

18:17 <mattst88> \o/ thanks

18:19 <mattst88> so cool to see stuff like this land. I was poking at SSA-based RA on Intel back in 2014...

18:24 * jekstrand is very interested as well

18:24 <jekstrand> I've changed my tune, I think, and now think I should have tried harder for SSA with IBC.

18:24 <jekstrand> TBH, if we could convert it to SSA, that would probably make the difference to allow us to land it.

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19:59 <mattst88> I still find myself half way through a mesa build, wondering why ccache is not doing much to help

19:59 <mattst88> and then realize that I did 'git checkout master'

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20:02 <dj-death> heh

20:05 <jekstrand> mattst88: Could be worse. You could be doing kernel dev.

20:05 <mattst88> definitely

20:06 <jekstrand> My bi-weekly rebase usually costs 20m of build time or so

20:06 <mattst88> ouch

20:07 <jekstrand> Not gonna lie. I'm kinda wishing for a desktop these days...

20:07 <jekstrand> With maybe an i9 or a xeon or a threadripper or something.

20:08 <Plagman> i highly recommend the 3990x

20:08 <Plagman> it seems overkill at first but still a giant different for building kernels and other things compared to even the 32-core ones

20:09 <mattst88> 5950x was briefly in stock on newegg this week

20:09 <airlied> even a few years old desktop xeon kicks most laptops asses I'd expect

20:09 <Plagman> except an new macbook air with m1 because apparently those can do anything faster than anyone else, with no power

20:10 <Plagman> (according to the internet)

20:10 <airlied> oh yes those are made from magic beans

20:15 <HdkR> Threadripper is an interesting market, since scalpers don't play there so it's usually in stock.

20:15 <HdkR> Definitely recommend it as well. Makes my unit test runs :pinched_fingers:

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20:17 <mattst88> I was surprised to see how expensive motherboards are these days

20:17 <mattst88> like $500+ motherboards are not unusual

20:18 <mattst88> also: lol @ scalpers not caring about threadripper: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0815SBQ9W

20:19 <mattst88> > Price: $5,789.99

20:20 <HdkR> Well at least TR pro is available at MSRP :P

20:25 <FLHerne> Even my 3900X is literally 50x faster than the laptop I was using before

20:26 <bl4ckb0ne> i upgraded from a haswell i5 to a 3700x and its worth every money unit

20:26 <FLHerne> (Bobcat kind of sucked)

20:28 <HdkR> s/kind of//

20:29 <FLHerne> well, the battery life was decent

20:29 <FLHerne> and the GPU was actually pretty good for a cheap laptop

20:29 <FLHerne> but yeah, "slower than a heavily-sedated sloth" or whatever Linus said

20:34 <HdkR> haha

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22:43 <pinchartl> sravn: I hate adding -Wno-error=... options to the kernel build, every time it recompiles everything from scratch :-(

22:43 * pinchartl needs a fast - and silent - build machine

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23:11 <jekstrand> Get an M1. I hear they're faster than a Xeon server, fanless and run for days on a single AA battery.

23:11 <imirkin_> AAA*

23:11 <jekstrand> Sorry

23:12 <imirkin_> i thought it ran on energy picked up from wifi

23:14 <icecream95> No, but you can use AirDrop to transfer power from your neighbour's iPhone

23:15 <jekstrand> imirkin_: I use batteries because I don't want to get COVID from the 5G.

23:15 <imirkin_> jekstrand: logical.

23:17 <Lightkey> Elementary, my dear Watson.

23:18 <imirkin_> this just makes me want to watch 'virus alert' again

23:20 * icecream95 wonders how long it will be until he can take the vaccine and stop wearing a tinfoil mask when going past 5G towers

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