ChanServ changed the topic of #wayland to: https://wayland.freedesktop.org | Discussion about the Wayland protocol and its implementations, plus libinput | register your nick to speak
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<wlb> wayland-protocols Merge request !190 opened by Simon Ser (emersion) xdg-output: clarify goal https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland-protocols/-/merge_requests/190 [xdg-output]
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<wlb> wayland Issue #350 opened by Simon Ser (emersion) Clarify interactions between wl_surface.leave and wl_output destruction https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland/-/issues/350 [Protocol]
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<zxd> Hi
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<zxd> is wayland development going well ?
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<daniels> yep!
<zxd> good, I remember in the 90s Linux was taking off and I saw how slow X was I said this is terrible someone code a new Windowing system now
<zxd> too bad I didnt know any c/c++
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<zubzub> if I launch weston with the headless backend + use-gl it's stuck on "launching '/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/weston-desktop-shell'"
<zubzub> this happens with weston v10 from debian testing as well as weston from ubuntu (v9)
<pq> zubzub, does it unstuck if you wait one minute?
<pq> how stuck is "stuck"?
<zubzub> not sure if I waited one minute let me try
<zubzub> when it's stuck, I can't connect with any client kind of stuck
<pq> hmm
<pq> how "can't connect"?
<pq> no socket found, opening socket failed, or something?
<zubzub> rebooting the server, will let you know asap :p
<pq> check your WAYLAND_DISPLAY is set right, just in case; it's likely wayland-1, not wayland-0
<pq> for the client, that is
<zubzub> "(gtk4-demo:1740): Gtk-WARNING **: 13:38:18.171: cannot open display"
<zubzub> I explicitly set it to wayland-0
<pq> try wayland-1
<zubzub> yeah that works o_O
<pq> Weston is avoiding wayland-0 socket name if it's not the "primary" compositor like with DRM-backend
<zubzub> oh ok
<pq> so all nested flavors and headless avoid the default socket name
<pq> at least those, not sure about DRM actually
<pq> the reason is, if your real desktop is X11, your real desktop apps don't suddenly start opening inside Weston
<zubzub> ic
<zubzub> ugh, weston on debian testing doesn't have linux dmabuf protocol?!
<pq> it should, surely
<zubzub> hmm, does it decide not to advertise it under certain conditions?
<pq> wayland-info is saying otherwise?
<pq> yeah, gl-renderer is required at least, so if you use pixman, then no dmabuf
<zubzub> hmmm, ah it's fallbacking to llvm mesa
<zubzub> even though I have nvidia 515 driver
<zubzub> an overlooked advantage of having a standing desk is that these are way to hard to flip over
<pq> I bet NVIDIA does not advertise support for the EGL surfaceless platform? So glvnd picks the one who does, which is Mesa/llvmpipe.
<zubzub> quite heavy and all
<zubzub> ok that might explain it
<pq> Weston's headless-backend with GL-renderer relies of the EGL surfaceless platform.
<pq> EGL EGLDevice platform could be an alternative I guess, but has not been implemented in Weston
<pq> Might not be a bad idea to add that, Mesa supports it too, right?
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<pq> which would put the burden of picking the GPU device on Weston code?
<zubzub> I guess so?
<zubzub> I've simpy put a config option in my implementation to pick the correct render device
<zubzub> man nvidia and wayland is still such an absolute PITA to get working... breaking in (clients in) all kinds of subtle ways
<zubzub> qt5 be like, ooh you have linux dmabuf protocol [using nvidia driver in the compositor], let me use it and then use mesa nouveau 😭
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<zubzub> oh you're giving a talk at fosdem daniels
<zubzub> "what do these window system people even do all day, anyway?"
<zubzub> the most important question
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<MrCooper> thinking of new ways to break things which were working perfectly in X, obviously
<zubzub> the answer will surprise you!
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<MrCooper> it's INSANE
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<daniels> zubzub: heh yep, it’s nowhere near as interesting as yours!
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<zubzub> I should probably do a new talk next year
<zubzub> maybe nvidias driver will be good enough to run (sdl) games without them segfaulting!
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<vyivel> is creating multiple xdg_surface object for the same wl_surface legal? afaiu yes, but weston (and only weston) says that "xdg_surface must not have any other role"
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<jadahl> vyivel: it's illegal. looking at mutter it should check and deny a client trying to call get_xdg_surface if there is already an active xdg_surface instance
<vyivel> got it; right now, wlroots, kwin, and smithay allow it too
<vyivel> the protocol should explicitly state that, though
<vyivel> "It is illegal to create an xdg_surface for a wl_surface which already has an assigned role", but creating an xdg_surface alone doesn't set a role
<jadahl> sure, makes sense to tweak that wording to make it clear
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<i509vcb> There is the fun issue of creating an xdg_surface and then a layer surface for example. It should be theoretically illegal per the text of the protocol but I don't recall it being implemented right anywhere
<i509vcb> What I recall from that is xdg_surface assigns a sort of pseudo role
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<jadahl> i509vcb: yea, creating an xdg_surface without also later creating a role object using xdg_surface makes no sense
<vyivel> xdg_surface as an intermediate object for setting a role makes no sense either tbh
<vyivel> also yeah, creating an e.g. layer surface would be illegal: "the corresponding surface may only be assigned a role extending xdg_surface, such as xdg_toplevel or xdg_popup"
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<jadahl> vyivel: xdg_surface is the "abstract" role the same as abstract classes work in OO
<jadahl> the fact that we need to first create it then something else is just how Wayland protocols tend to work
<i509vcb> OO in the protocol drives me up a wall lol
<vyivel> jadahl: i understand it, i just think it would make sense for xdg_surface to be the role object itself
<i509vcb> You can't turn an xdg_toplevel into a xdg_popup however
<i509vcb> It seems to act more like a role group and then a concrete role
<jadahl> yea, xdg_surface isn't a role because it's just a toolbox of useful things that most roles happen to need
<vyivel> most roles (two)
<jadahl> there are some ideas for more: xdg_splash, xdg_pip
<vyivel> eh, right
<vyivel> xdg_surface.get_popup taking xdg_surface as parent is a bit ugly in that case
<vyivel> should probably add an error for "invalid popup parent" or something like that too
<jadahl> get_popup takes a xdg_surface as a parent because the parent can be both a xdg_toplevel and xdg_popup
<vyivel> yes, but if an xdg_surface is used as a base for hypothetical xdg_splash, it shouldn't be allowed
<i509vcb> I could see a pip having a reason to maybe have a popup, but not splash
<jadahl> yea, sure, and there already is a 'invalid_popup_parent' error
<jadahl> it will now be raised if you e.g. create circular popups
<jadahl> ..chains
<vyivel> oh, indeed there is
<vyivel> it's fine then
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