ChanServ changed the topic of #wayland to: https://wayland.freedesktop.org | Discussion about the Wayland protocol and its implementations, plus libinput | register your nick to speak
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<pq>
oh hey, wlb works again for weston too. :-)
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<pq>
swick[m], I'm attacking the rendering intent next for the protocol. Are you continuing with the HDR static metadata?
<swick[m]>
sure, seems easy enough
<pq>
will need image description events for the metadata too
<swick[m]>
yeah, noticed that as well
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<pq>
I think I've finally understood why I read from somewhere that one should never fill a chromaticity diagram with colors.
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<vsyrjala>
one should just leave it blank or what?
<pq>
yes
<pq>
especially around the center, any specific x,y point does not have a specific color appearance. However, if you fill the diagram with colors, you are implicitly giving each point a specific appeareance.
<vsyrjala>
i suppose. but it does provide the "this way towards reddish" sort of hint
<emersion>
maybe only use colors for the primaries?
<vsyrjala>
but yeah, remembering that the colors aren't real is hard
<pq>
Which x,y point looks the most "white"? That is dictated by the viewer and their environment, it's not any one x,y point.
<swick[m]>
that also changes the appearance of the primaries
<emersion>
right, but maybe it's more obvious that it's just a hint that way
<pq>
emersion, yes, denoting primaries with colored point is fine, in that it doesn't give a wrong idea.
<emersion>
what's the difference here between the white point and primaries?
<emersion>
the white point is more of a lie than the primaries?
<JEEB>
H.273/CICP primaries points contain a white point as well, so most likely that's why that exists there, too
<pq>
In that very specific context, primaries are your R, G and B lamps, and white point is the chromaticity they emit when each one has equal power.
<emersion>
hm, and so there's no single white point on the graph?
<pq>
correct
<emersion>
it's more of a line in the 3D space?
<pq>
a monitor has a single white point, and you find it my setting all color channel to equal values.
<pq>
or simply to max values
<JEEB>
yup
<pq>
another monitor may have a different white point
<pq>
if you have only primaries, your definition of a color space is not complete without the white point, because the white point puts the primaries into the same "scale".
<pq>
Each primary has its own "scale of strength", and when you start mixing them to produce other, ahem, colors, you need to know their relative strength.
<pq>
That is all colorimetry, physically measurable quantities, like CIE 1931 x,y.
<pq>
Appearance, or what does a certain x,y *look* like, is another matter.
<pq>
That depends on what you, the viewer, have adapted to.
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<pq>
If I was living in a room lit only with pale green lights, and you came in from outdoors, I might say "this paper looks white" while you say "how can you live here when everything looks so green?" :-)
<pq>
It's an exaggeration, but it's real.
<pq>
Ever thought why seeing a TV through a window while you are outside looks so blue, yet when you watch TV inside it looks normal?
<swick[m]>
pq: I don't think I can add any of the luminance metadata before we have not defined the reference display and reference viewing environment in the protocol
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<swick[m]>
for PQ this is all tied closely together but everywhere else it already breaks apart
<swick[m]>
even for PQ you have to assume that the mastering display viewing environment is the same as the reference viewing environment
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