ChanServ changed the topic of #asahi-alt to: Asahi Linux: porting Linux to Apple Silicon macs | User-contributed/unofficial distribution ports | Logs: https://alx.sh/l/asahi-alt
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<chadmed>
leio: i did eventually manage to bootstrap an install off fedora
<chadmed>
but it wasnt fun
<chadmed>
i am swamped with other stuff but will eventually push fixes for asahi-gentoosupport
<chadmed>
the one thing i could never get to work properly was vfat modprobing automatically
<chadmed>
the kernel message buffer is full of stupid errors too but they dont actually break anything
<leio>
would replacing the fedora kernel in the fedora install with a asahi-sources gentoo kernel early be a good option too?
<leio>
and let me know how I can help, need some handholding due to missing a lot of context and knowledge, but maybe I can help with things like stage3 images or whatnot
<chadmed>
well no because then youd need to install all the build deps for the kernel, pull down the sources, build it, install it, then spin _that_ into the livecd squashfs
<chadmed>
waste of time
<leio>
make my old gentoo arm64 project membership count for something instead of hanging on there still after a 2-3 year old arm64 handling spree :)
<chadmed>
what i would like eventually is just a minimal livecd with the gentoo kernel and modules swapped out for asahi kernel and modules
<leio>
that sounds quite feasible and not too hard work in coordination with gentoo releng
<chadmed>
because all this nonsense of pivoting into an initramfs from a minimal asahi install was just to avoid having to dissect and wrap my head around how fucking stupid the gentoo livecd boot process is
<chadmed>
sam_: might have some ideas
<chadmed>
i tried to do it myself but it never worked so i landed on this solution as a stop-gap
<chadmed>
also means we dont have to modify the actual asahi installer
<leio>
maybe I should wait for my install to get that going quickly - I don't see myself reinstalling things to test the result
<chadmed>
but eventually users being able to select the "uefi only" option in the installer and put a usb stick in would be sick
<chadmed>
all the usb boot stuff works, its just getting a known-good kernel into the livecd image and making it boot that stumped me
<leio>
so then we could try out any livecd/liveusb distro from usb stick?
<leio>
(provided they have suitable kernel)
<leio>
I guess for a system install, there's still the APFS resizing and such that the asahi-installer cares for
<leio>
and m1n1/u-boot
<chadmed>
theres an option in the asahi-installer to just install the m1n1/u-boot
<chadmed>
which is exactly what we want
<chadmed>
the ideal workflow is basically vanilla asahi-installer makes some free space and does all the SEP/macOS stuff -> user puts in a usb flashed with our special livecd image -> user follows gentoo handbook
<chadmed>
with that last step being interrupted by our little install helper that takes care of setting up the overlay and pulling in asahi-meta
<leio>
which eventually could be in ::gentoo to some extent
<chadmed>
yeah id like to upstream some stuff eventually
<chadmed>
went on a big QA spree a while ago getting the packages up to scratch with proper metadata and stuff
<leio>
I guess the main one that's a bit tough would be mesa, until it isn't sufficiently upstream mesa
<leio>
ok, so what should I do now to actually install it via the ideal method
<leio>
get a livecd with asahi-sources?
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<leio>
how will it boot over usb
<leio>
my understanding was that apple silicon doesn't do that - the UEFI thing installs something that can do it?
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<chadmed>
leio: no what you need to do right now to get it installed is hack on genstrap.sh to make it work with fedora
<mps>
leio: I have no idea how gentoo could be installed but maybe this could help to give you idea
<leio>
I'm not in a hurry to get it going in itself - if I can come up with a better install method via livecd, I'd rather dogfood that for the install
<chadmed>
i made it work with fedora a while ago but because i am exceedingly stupid and an idiot i was making changes in the copy i had stored on the fedora rootfs... which i then wiped when i got it working and installed gentoo...
<leio>
still got my zen2 here and short-term work work is on mac for ios
<chadmed>
mps: those scripts look very familiar :P
<mps>
chadmed: ?
<mps>
familiar to what
<chadmed>
i do something very similar to turn the gentoo livecd into an asahi-friendly initramfs
<chadmed>
then add a grub entry and boot to it
<mps>
ah, would be nice if can look at this to steel some good things
<mps>
steal*
<chadmed>
the issue we have is that the gentoo livecd itself boots a weird stub which then extracts a squashfs to memory and pivots to that which contains the _real_ kernel and modules etc
<chadmed>
its very odd
<chadmed>
like i said, i got far enough in to pluck the squashfs out of the cd image but then gave up trying to manipulate both it and the image itself and just wrapped the squashfs in an initramfs
<chadmed>
i think given the time it takes to actually install gentoo its been an acceptable tradeoff until now, and its really only a problem now because things are in flux
<mps>
alpine standard isos use also squashfs
<mps>
but I still didn't decide to make iso, simpler is usb image
<chadmed>
yeah i see what youre doing now, that makes a lot more sense
<leio>
maybe we can just make a stage4 and dump that on usb?
<chadmed>
i was thinking reuse the existing infrastructure we have to pull out and manipulate the squashfs, but extract it to a bootable usb
<mps>
if it is possible to install gentoo on target with some scripting then simple usb image (even alpine) could be used, I guess
<chadmed>
my whole thing is that i like to make these things self-hosting because i dont think i can keep my web server uptime high enough to host images/build artefacts
<leio>
so what you're saying is that I could just take your alpine usb boot image and do the normal gentoo chroot install from there
<mps>
for now I have no idea only how to extract asmedia firmware to put it in initramfs
<leio>
we should aim to just get liveusb or whatever images built as part of the normal stage3/livecd builds in releng
<chadmed>
yeah that would be ideal
<leio>
so tell me what I need to do to achieve that
<leio>
in terms of what and how in the image
<chadmed>
literally the only difference is the kernel, if releng can spin out a livecd with the asahi kernel and its modules then thats all that needs to change
<chadmed>
i dont change anything else about the root extracted from the image
<leio>
no problem with that inbetween stubbing or whatnot?
<leio>
ok, then where do I find the kernel config to use? :)
<leio>
with your overlay asahi-sources
<chadmed>
i can chuck mine in a gist, should be enough to work across all currently supported devices
<chadmed>
actually let me get a gist together that summarises what we need and where
<leio>
note that mine is a currently unsupported device :)
<chadmed>
the config shouldnt change for t602x
<leio>
yeah, I might need to somehow hack it to pass some kernel options to keep the display on after m1n1 and later early patches for gpu support or smth
<chadmed>
just joined the gentoo channels on libera too if we want to discuss with others there, just ping me
<leio>
chadmed: think you might want #gentoo-releng
<chadmed>
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<leio>
can you expand on the -march=native bit (which imo is really -mcpu=native on arm)
<leio>
what isn't detected right
<leio>
wouldn't some sort of a stage4 be something we could maybe just provide as an option to asahi-installer then instead?
<leio>
chadmed: as in, why's liveusb better than bootstrapping a full system right from the asahi-installer (via e.g. curl https://asahi.gentoo.org |sh or something too)?
<leio>
where full I mean same kind of scope as is in the livecd, you get to a console with wifi stack available
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<chadmed>
leio: i dont think its really in the spirit of gentoo for starters
<chadmed>
and even more politically i think it gives these machines too much of an "embedded" image
<chadmed>
they should not behave like an rpi4 because theyre like 999 grillion times more useable and powerful
<chadmed>
i dont want the install procedure to look anything like it does on a shitty little SBC
<chadmed>
i want it to look like it does on a workstation, because thats what these machines are
<leio>
to me it's about the choice - choice to not have to care about this stuff, just choose it in an installer I already have to use anyways, and then just pick my profiles and run emerge -e if I want to recompile it all
<chadmed>
i think thats perfectly valid, and id be happy to host the image and installer if you end up throwing it together
<leio>
I mean at an official capacity under gentoo.org too, I guess
<chadmed>
do such images exist for any other platform? i thought all those SBC images were community maintained
<leio>
but short-term, it might be a quicker way to get things going for me too? This is presuming I can just run through the process again for testing things later with a secondary gentoo install too in my plenty of available space?
<chadmed>
the rpi4 one certainly was
<sam_>
I want us to get to a point where we have proper flashable images for SBCs but I agree that's not super helpful for this
<sam_>
I'll read the rest of the backlog now
<sam_>
but my gut would be "figure out how to just do installcds w/ custom kernel for arm64, build that on our infra"
<sam_>
that should be easy (TM)
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<leio>
chadmed: can you share that kernel config please?