marcan changed the topic of #asahi to: Asahi Linux: porting Linux to Apple Silicon macs | General project discussion | GitHub: https://alx.sh/g | Wiki: https://alx.sh/w | Topics: #asahi-dev #asahi-re #asahi-gpu #asahi-stream #asahi-offtopic | Keep things on topic | Logs: https://alx.sh/l/asahi
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<cth451_desktop> I'm not sure if it's just me or Mac OS has HDCP encryption on all the time.
<cth451_desktop> Hooked my mac mini to a hdmi capture card. Even in 1TR the capture card says the signal carries HDCP encrypted conteng.
<cth451_desktop> * contents
<cth451_desktop> but apparently no such weirdness occurs under m1n1 / linux kernel
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<kode54> heh
<kode54> my HDMI capture card negotiates HDCP
<cth451_desktop> Ugh. Probably should get one that terminates HDCP.
<cth451_desktop> Even nintendont switch knows that HDCP is only for youtube
<kode54> I periodically have HDCP negotiation failure with my secondary monitor, resulting in rainbow static
<kode54> I have to sleep the displays and wake them again when that happens
<cth451_desktop> That's annoying
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<kode54> doesn't happen that often, and usually only when waking from lengthy display sleep
<kode54> I have system sleep disabled because sleep failures happened occasionally, resulting in watchdog timeouts and kernel panics
<cth451_desktop> Under mac os or linux?
<kode54> mac os
<kode54> I haven't tried running linux on it yet
<cth451_desktop> (if that sounds a bit ridiculous
<cth451_desktop> * if that's mac os it sounds
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<cth451_desktop> I guess M1 minis would not have sound over HDMI until GNU driver gets fully implemented?
<cth451_desktop> * GPU driver
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<jn> cth451_desktop: i find that unlikely. in ARM SoCs, the different parts that would make up a desktop graphics card (3D engine, display controller, audio stuff) are usually dissolved, independent components
<jn> for example, there is already a working display controller driver, even though the GPU (3D) driver wasn't started
<jn> in the same way, i guess the audio-over-HDMI driver could be finished independently of any GPU functionality
<cth451_desktop> Ah thanks for the explanation
<cth451_desktop> Sounds like it would be an independent digital audio output device
<cth451_desktop> and the audio would get muxed in by some sort of HDMI controller
<jn> this last step might involve the display controller
<jn> not sure
<sven> possibly even the mess that will be the type c phy (atc-phy)
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<marcan> the HDCP thing is a longstanding macos stupidity
<marcan> it greedily enables HDCP, always, if the sink supports it
<marcan> which means that capture cards that have HDCP for passthrough only are unusable with macOS
<marcan> I had to get an HDCP stripper for the Euskal Encounter streaming/capture rig for this reason. dude showed up with a Mac and we couldn't capture it.
<marcan> HDMI audio on the Mini would not involve ATC
<marcan> there are some dpaudio blocks IIRC which I assume are in charge of this
<marcan> not sure if they hook up to the MCA audio stuff or are independent
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<povik> marcan: seems they are independent. the sio coprocessor is involved for dma, so it is a different path altogether
<sven> did you look into sio in detail? i'm curious if it's really just a co-processor that just reades/writes the registers in busy loops and then pretends it's actually DMA for the main CPU
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<povik> a little at the very beginning, before i realized sio is not in the loop for the speaker :D
<sven> fair :D
<sven> i know it's also involved in what macOS claims to be SPI DMA
<sven> but i kinda suspect it really just uses the normal SPI regs to allow off-loading the busy loop
<povik> i didn't even succeed in getting a sign of life back then, although i didn't spend much time at it
<povik> hm, interesting
<marcan> sven: and yeah, I strongly suspect sio is just that
<marcan> the firmware just has a pile of strings for each of the generic serial interfaces
<marcan> and is otherwise quite tiny
<sven> yeah, exactly
<sven> and the protocol seems to be just sending a message with a IOVA, a size and some flags afaict
<j_ey> sounds Very Smart
<sven> which really smells like "just read data from $interface and put it into $buffer"
<marcan> why have 500 lines of verilog to do DMA when you can have a whole ARMv8-A CPU!
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<leo60228> are the progress reports still monthly? i've been looking forward to the october one
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<marcan> in theory... once I catch up on kernel stuff...
<marcan> october was busier than usual
<leo60228_> ah
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<as400> I have another question - I'm reading the channel for a few days what gives me an idea what is happening. But one thing is a mystery for me. What is the current status of gpu drivers ? Asking because I don't know - should I buy macbook now or wait ?
<j_ey> there's no kernel side GPU driver
<as400> ok - I guess this is one of the biggest challenges ?
<jn> rather, as i understand it, it's something that noone has seriously started yet
<jn> (the userspace (mesa) side is a different question — it already works, but only on macos)
<JTL> that's what I was about to say :P
<as400> ok - thx for the info.
<jn> as400: and display output is yet another question
<jn> simple (not non-ideal) display output has worked almost since the beginning, better display output (using the DCP driver) is somewhere close to done too, i thin
<jn> k
<jn> s/not/but/
<as400> ok, display output is separate from gpu itself, right ?
<jn> yes
<opticron> IIRC, alyssa (the person that did the userland GPU shader compiler work) has been dogfooding either the air or the 13" MBP and runs a full desktop env
<opticron> and has nothing but good things to say about it even without GPU acceleration
<as400> Nice. I'm thinking of macbook as it seems to be really great piece of hardware engineering.
<as400> I obviously will not use macos so will have to wait for Linux. That's why I'm asking these questions.
<as400> It would be just stupid to buy it and then put it away.
<opticron> I'm of the same opinion
<opticron> I'm going to get a 14" probably M1P model in the near future as my daily driver and I don't even really care about GPU for the most part
<as400> Well - I use my private laptop for work. So I have to go on a teams meeting from time to time and stuff like that. I wonder how things like that would work without gpu acceleration.
<j_ey> pretty sure alyssa was watching 1080p videos without gpu accel
<as400> j_ey - really ? And it just worked ?
<j_ey> yep
<as400> Now i'm shocked. On an average x86 box without vaapi enabled CPU is just going mad.
<_jannau_> software decoding/encoding should not be problem
<opticron> also, video decoding is a separate engine from GPU
<_jannau_> what do you mean with mad? a running fan? software decoding is for x86 CPU also not a problem
<_jannau_> the M1 Pro/Max can decode higher bitrate 4k AV1 video with ~300fps
<as400> jannau: I mean with vaapi enabled my x86 laptop cpu's are doing almost nothing - like few percent of utilization. Without it utilization goes up to 70% with 1080p60
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<_jannau_> I however don't think HW support is yet far enough to be used normal notebook
<as400> jannau: that's why I'm asking these questions - just to make some wise decisions. Although I would like to have it now :)
<_jannau_> 70% seems high for 1080@60 but without details CPU, video codec and bitrate it's impossible to say anything
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<as400> It's ryzen 4800U - don't remember a codec.
<_jannau_> the 70% were on a single CPU core? we're drifting into off-topic though. SW decoding works but can use quite a lot of CPU. that's the reason why there are accelerators for video decoding
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<leo60228> jn: "rather, as i understand it, it's something that noone has seriously started yet" i feel like alyssa was tweeting about basic compute shaders working a day or two ago? i thought she meant on linux but mb she meant that she was implementing compute shaders in mesa
<leo60228> actually i think she was maybe debugging compute shaders on mali?
<leo60228> not sure
<j_ey> yeah that was about panfrost
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<sven> yeah, no one has started to look at the kernel side yet
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<sven> there's still enough other stuff to be done to make upstream useable on these machines
<mps> I contemplated about 9-10 months to buy or not buy m1 macbook as daily driver machine and finaly bought it, running linux in qemu VM on macos for now
<mps> main reason for me is the good display and not mirrors (practically) as I have on my two chromebooks which are unusable outside room
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<mps> I'm only missing sound card driver to switch to using linux daily instead to boot macos
<mps> apple software is terrible for me but hardware is good enough
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<marcan> I don't even expect the GPU kernel driver to be that hard to write, but yeah, we just have enough other stuff on our plate right now
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<krbtgt> GPU driver will the cherry on top
<krbtgt> not the whole cake
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