14:22 <onelegend> wayland

14:42 <kennylevinsen> Yes.

14:45 <onelegend> nice

14:56 <wb9688> UGDCP?

14:57 <wb9688> Just a bunch of random letters or did you have some definition for it in your head?

14:59 <kennylevinsen> No matter was done to ensure understanding, evolution would bring about a stronger and more resilient form of ignorance to defeat it.

15:08 <dottedmag> wb9688: Something like "Unix graphics display compositor protocol"

15:12 <dottedmag> kennylevinsen: True. However one does not often see end user blaming HTTP for their troubles

15:22 <kennylevinsen> I imagine that's mostly because they're rarely confronted with what HTTP really is, and doesn't have any news articles telling them to change over to it as the next big thing. :)

15:32 <dottedmag> "Wayland" is a catchy name for news too. It's an interesting lesson: if I ever need to design a protocol that's not directly user-facing I won't give it a catchy name.

15:34 <immibis> is it a protocol, though, or a system? X11 is technically just a protocol, but there are significant implications for choosing to use it. The protocol affects the whole user experience and the kinds of things you can do and software you can use

15:34 <immibis> in the HTTP case we call the system "the web" and not "HTTP"

16:40 <kennylevinsen> immibis: it is only a protocol

16:41 <kennylevinsen> The protocol specifications are developed in this forum, while servers and clients are written elsewhere. Thus, "Wayland" is just a bunch of XML files.

16:42 <kennylevinsen> (the exception being that there is a few example implementations made here, and that compositor/toolkit writers tend to compose this group, akin to how other protocol specs tend to be industry driven)

16:45 <dcz> I think what immibis is getting at is that this is the technical definition, similar to "Linux" technically, and "Linux" in common usage. Using the protocol definition doesn't account for the usage when people ask "does it work on Wayland?"

16:45 <dcz> in this sense, the protocols imply a wider ecosystem

16:53 <immibis> does it help if you mentally substitute "on wayland" -> "on a wayland server"?

16:54 <immibis> you don't have to specify which server. If my question is "does Apache work with Gemini clients?" the answer is "no" and I do not have to specify which client

17:51 <wb9688> kennylevinsen: "But libwayland-client/server/whatever exists"

17:55 <dottedmag> dcz: (unrelated side-note) I find it quite annoying when software only works on GNU/Linux. That is, it depends on shelling out to a tool from coreutils et al with a flag that's not understood by busybox