#wayland on 2022-08-08 — irc logs at oftc.irclog.whitequark.org

2022-03-22 11:59 ChanServ changed the topic of #wayland to: https://wayland.freedesktop.org | Discussion about the Wayland protocol and its implementations, plus libinput | register your nick to speak

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08:15 <kchibisov> How one would handle resize increments with Wayland in a sort of reliable way? In general I think it's sort of possible for cliend side decorations and interactive resize, but not sure abount server side ones. On X11 there's a `PResizeInc` for that on the other side.

08:17 <kchibisov> Maybe tiled state of the window can be used to control that? Like if any of the edges are tiled don't try incremental resizes and when you know that the window isn't tiled do increments?

08:18 <emersion> the compositor will send you a desired size, you can snap it to the closest increment

08:18 <emersion> if maximized or tiled, you need to obey the compositor

08:19 <emersion> (otherwise the compositor won't know what to fill the gap with)

08:19 <emersion> but if you're not maximized nor tiled, you can snap to the closest multiple

08:20 <kchibisov> That's what I thought, thx.

08:20 <kchibisov> And how to deal with maximum sizes the compositor clamping windows to?

08:21 <kchibisov> For example on sway you can't make a window larger than a virtual screen.

08:21 <kchibisov> (A combination of resolutions of all monitors).

08:21 <emersion> virtual screen?

08:21 <kchibisov> I mean virtual coordinate space bounds, not sure how to call it.

08:22 <emersion> ah, didn't remember that sway forces windows to be smaller than the full output layout

08:22 <emersion> well, during interactive resize you just won't get sizes larger than that

08:22 <emersion> ie, the configure events sent by sway will always be smaller

08:23 <emersion> but there shouldn't be anything special required to deal with it

08:23 <kchibisov> Yeah, but that would mean that I'd try to draw the buffer the sway can't handle without cropping.

08:23 <emersion> i don't think sway will crop in this situation?

08:24 <kchibisov> Well, other compositors can.

08:24 <emersion> i mean, if the client draws a very large buffer

08:25 <emersion> if they do, that'd break rendering for such clients

08:25 <kchibisov> Would be nice to have a way to know the maximum size of the window that could be drawn, so I can clamp increments to it.

08:25 <emersion> does that really matter in practice?

08:26 <kchibisov> I don't think so.

08:26 <kchibisov> I'm not sure you resize a window manually to be that large.

08:26 <emersion> sway's maximum size is just a user convenience feature, to avoid having very large windows which are complicated to deal with

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20:22 <zebrag> Some "gestures" I understand, are hardcoded in touchpads

20:22 <zebrag> However there is no counterpart for touchscreens

20:24 <zebrag> I understand though, that windows does have "long-press is right-click" on their tablet version

20:24 <zebrag> Because of that every application has to reinvent the wheel in implementing long-press right-click, or not

20:25 <zebrag> Also, I understand that linux applications are working with windows, when they don't on linux

20:25 <zebrag> because windows provides upstream long-press right-click

20:26 <zebrag> Question: is there a plan to implement that gesture at wayland/libinput level? (long press on touch screen)

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20:47 <zebrag> https://phabricator.kde.org/T10783

20:47 <zebrag> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08hW7aWvTKk&t=131s

20:47 <zebrag> https://bugreports.qt.io/browse/QTBUG-84179

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20:48 <zebrag> hopefully when this issue is solved, tablet will be long forgotten

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21:41 <kennylevinsen> zebrag: there's pointer emulation for clients not binding wl_touch. For clients supporting touch, we don't get in the way. We're stuck handling it for touchpads due to how they're historically implemented, would've been nicer if we could expose it the same way as wl_touch...

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21:44 <zebrag> googling wl_touch

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21:48 <emersion> it would be nice to have a touch gesture library

21:50 <zebrag> it would be nice to have applications to actually work (with tablet only), without the developer having to tweak its application for tablet use, which they'll probably won't do

21:51 <zebrag> I mean, for now it doesn't seem possible to use linux on a tablet

21:51 <zebrag> because applications don't work

21:52 <kennylevinsen> if they bind to wl_touch they're asking to handle touch themselves, and then they need to do the work

21:52 <i509VCB> If it was just state tracking that would be nice.

21:52 <i509VCB> I'd like to avoid giving away control of the seat implementation to some library

21:52 <kennylevinsen> otherwise maybe you need better pointer emulation in your compositor

21:53 <zebrag> on https://phabricator.kde.org/T10783 they were arguing about what is the "best" way to do it, and some were really clinging to weird solutions

21:53 <zebrag> kennylevinsen: yes, my compositor has specifically no pointer emulation

21:54 <zebrag> answer is, every app should do as it likes best

21:54 <zebrag> that is chaos

21:55 <zebrag> on windows or android tablet, things are not so fancy, but they do work

21:59 <zebrag> Solution described here seems to be de facto standard, so why not use it? https://phabricator.kde.org/transactions/raw/PHID-XACT-TASK-3gpbz7m6crgb64f/ (it's windows and android solution, and everybody that have used a tablet, will recognize it)

22:01 <zebrag> After a while @ngraham decided to give up https://phabricator.kde.org/transactions/raw/PHID-XACT-TASK-xqubqpef4rp53n3/

22:01 <kennylevinsen> If the app isn't binding wl_touch *and* your compositor lack pointer emulation, then there's no way the app can react to touch and that can't really change

22:02 <zebrag> yes, I must use another compositor

22:02 <zebrag> which do you use?

22:02 <kennylevinsen> My own, not really "production-grade"

22:03 <zebrag> you mean, wayland way is make your own compositor?

22:04 <zebrag> Do you know a compositor that would allow to read pdf on a tablet?

22:06 <zebrag> I think there are solutions using legacy x11, but I don't want legacy

22:07 <kennylevinsen> No I just mean that I use my own compositor, answering your question honestly.

22:08 <kennylevinsen> I think sway's pointer emulation would be fine for that?

22:09 <zebrag> Yes

22:09 <kennylevinsen> There's also phosh which targets smartphones

22:10 <zebrag> I when on #sway a few days ago, suggesting maybe sway would be the best solution for tablets. They thought the idea was weird.

22:10 <zebrag> Yes, there is phosh

22:11 <zebrag> unfortunately it crashes on my debian, maybe I should try again

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22:14 <zebrag> I've just logged into phosh, but the scrren turned off like 3 sec after login in

22:15 <zebrag> there is no #phosh

22:23 <zebrag> Second entry in googling "phosh touchscreen settings" -> "This shouldn't be an app-specific function. Phosh (if it was developed right) should know that a long-press = right click. For any any application." https://forum.pine64.org/showthread.php?tid=13120&pid=90458#pid90458

22:26 <kennylevinsen> Nothing weird about using sway for that - people use it on the pinephone - just might necessarily not be optimized for it

22:27 <kennylevinsen> Yeah posting opinions off Google won't change how things work

22:28 <zebrag> I only use google to look for information, I'm totally agnostic there

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22:30 <kennylevinsen> As for phosh, maybe the librem guys have a generic channel for their products

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22:31 <zebrag> yes, looking into it

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