ChanServ changed the topic of #dri-devel to: <ajax> nothing involved with X should ever be unable to find a bar
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<alyssa>
Sachiel: oh, lordy lordy
<alyssa>
nice :)
<alyssa>
yeah, that's what changed - I had nvk in my build enabled because of what I was hacking on yesterday.
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<alyssa>
entertaining. thanks :}
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<tzimmermann>
sima, mripard, can we talk about that probe-helper patchset? the premise is: to keep compositors happy, we cannot report more 'connected' connectors than there are crtcs available.
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<tzimmermann>
this can happen with any driver. ast and mgag200 only expose the problem because their hardware is so limited
<tzig>
Hey everyone, just to make sure, is this the right channel for user-space usage questions or is this one more for the developement of the module/subsystem?
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<eric_engestrom>
thanks sergi! that change makes perfect sense 👍
<eric_engestrom>
I also had a quick look and there is no other `running` by itself so hopefully that's the last bug of this category :)
<soreau>
tzig: ask your real question and find out
<eric_engestrom>
gfxstrand: yes to creating issues, I don't always follow irc and even if I see something it's easy to forget
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<tzig>
Okay sure, so I've been banging my head for a few weeks on this: I have some custom hardware with a Mercury+ XU7 SoC. I need to render an image on the GPU and send it to the FPGA part of the SoC (mapped to a physical address on the memory bus), I'm using lima as my DRM so no DUMB Buffers, I created a GEM and I'm stuck at the part where I need to give OpenGL/EGL the physical address, and from what I can gather a dma will work its magic and send
<tzig>
the data without any costly glReadPixels. I've tried a few dozen things but can't manage to make it work, I'd be very glad for any pointers cause the documentation online is sparse, to say the least
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<sima>
tzimmermann, yeah, but the issue is that this does reduce functionality
<sima>
and the compositors are just broken if the fall over with that
<sima>
the bmc is kinda special because no regression rules, but otherwise I really don't think we should try to hack around this in the kernel
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<sima>
compositors already have heuristics like preferring panels
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<daniels>
yeah; Weston at least will just pick a random connector and assign it to that CRTC and it certainly should work just fine
<daniels>
having more connectors than CRTCs is massively common
<daniels>
but having them all (falsely?) report connected is definitely not common
<daniels>
I'm not sure what else userspace could really do here
<mripard>
why couldn't they all be connected? I mean, I get the uAPI discussion, but what makes it so uncommon at the hardware level that it's unreasonable to expect it?
<daniels>
if they're all connected then that's fine, but we have to pick only one to light up, unless clone actually works
<daniels>
and given that we're talking about a regression here - what changed to regress it? at which point did it work?
<sima>
adding the always-connected bmc changed things
<soreau>
unless all connectors use the same mode from the crtc?
<sima>
but in the end userspace needs to decide which one to light up when both are connected
<sima>
soreau, often even more restrictions apply, like you can't clone across hdmi and dp
<sima>
so many compositors stopped bothering with clone support
<soreau>
not wayfire :P
<mripard>
sima: but that's the part I don't get, why did it regress things? Is it because the default connector the compositor would pick change?
<HdkR>
Oh wow, no clone support? That would immediately ruin my duplicating a display that I use each day
<sima>
mripard, iirc yeah
<soreau>
HdkR: use wayfire :)
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<HdkR>
soreau: I'm still on the X11 train :P
<soreau>
HdkR: ouch
<sima>
the commit unfortunately lacks a bit details and I don't remember more what we discussed
<soreau>
HdkR: I haven't x11'd since 2018
<sima>
HdkR, hw clone, as in 2 outputs driven by same crtc
<HdkR>
oh
<sima>
most compositors do clone with 2 crtcs for 2 outputs
<soreau>
yea, wayfire just fakes it
<HdkR>
Okay, that's way more reasonable
<sima>
10-20 years ago it was much more commonly used, when gpus had 1-2 crtcs max
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<HdkR>
NVIDIA has been stuck on 4 CRTCs for such a long time
<HdkR>
Would be nice if they boosted that to six at least on some configs
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<daniels>
weston does same-crtc clone \o/
<soreau>
double the trouble ;)
<tzimmermann>
sima, mripard, the problem is not strictly related to the bmc. i have an ast device with VGA and DP. if i connect both, the compositor error happens as well. there's been a patchset to do this. and i'm now in the situation where i'd have to add another workaround to the ast driver. hence my interest in solving this in a shared code
<sima>
tzimmermann, but why add that workaround to ast?
<sima>
the kms uapi very much is that there's possibly more connected connectors than crtcs
<tzimmermann>
because there are devices that support vga and dp with only a single CRTC. if someone tries to use both conenctors, the compositors will fall over
<sima>
yeah but that compositor is kinda broken
<tzimmermann>
sima, tell that to userspace
<sima>
happy to
<tzimmermann>
exactly my point :)
<sima>
like if it's a regression because we added bmc, kernel needs to paper around it
<sima>
otherwise, not the kernel's problem
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<sima>
also if it's a specific compositor, maybe, worst case, we'll do a gross hack matching the comm name like we've done for Xorg's atomic support
<sima>
but definitely can't do that for everyone
<tzimmermann>
sima, to my knowledge, it's gnome and kde and maybe others
<sima>
and we'd need some "I'm fixed now" escape
<tzimmermann>
even our in-kernel don't handle this well
<tzimmermann>
AFAIK, only weston supports cloning correctly
<sima>
yeah, maybe we should try to fix that first then ...
<sima>
old Xorg does too
<sima>
since it's old enough to have been around when cloning really mattered
<tzimmermann>
it's a problem in the gnome settings app; but maybe not the backend
<tzimmermann>
the issue happens with gnome on x as well
<sima>
tzimmermann, so what exactly is the issue? only lights up one of the outputs at random, or actually dies?
<tzimmermann>
when trying to set display modes, the settings app does nonsense
<sima>
and yeah if it also happens on Xorg there's pretty much nothing we can do, because we have no idea what's driving the xrandr proto
<tzimmermann>
independently from the actual backend (xorg, kms), the gnome settings app fails set any modes if there are more connected outputs than crtcs
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<tzimmermann>
it reports "incompatible hardware" without doing anything
<tzimmermann>
so changing display modes is not possible
<sima>
eh, feels like a not too horrible failure mode
<sima>
it's a bit impressive levels of suck, but oh well
<sima>
maybe improving the heuristics for fbcon might help, but otherwise this really is fully on userspace to suck less imo
<tzimmermann>
sima, but why do we even bother about the BMC then?
<sima>
dunno, I didn't merge the code for enabling that
<sima>
so don't ask my about the motivation for that
<tzimmermann>
sima, i did. but back then it was considered a kernel regression
<sima>
oh you mean why we bother with the hack for bmc?
<tzimmermann>
yeah
<sima>
yeah because regression, bmc was added later on
<sima>
but for anything that's always been there, it's just userspace being absolutely busted
<sima>
so should also limit that bmc hack only to the current set of ast/mgag200 hw, when/if we add more we should disable it for those
<sima>
since otherwise we'll never be able to retire this hack
<sima>
and if bmc would have been there from the start, we wouldn't have needed to do anything at all
<tzimmermann>
but if i add vga+dp support for ast, it will also regress userspace. that's patch 5 of my patchset
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<tzimmermann>
the distinction isn't really clear to me
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<sima>
oh yeah, I guess then you get to add the hack to more places
<sima>
or you don't, and wait for someone to report it as an actual regression
<sima>
maybe mutter gets fixed faster, since it's an issue across the board
<tzimmermann>
that's why i'd like to put the code in some shared place.
<sima>
also I thought for the bmc regression it was a case of "black screen, unusable"
<sima>
if the issue is only that mutter can't change the resolution, I'm much more leaning towards reverting those hacks
<tzimmermann>
sima, no black screen
<tzimmermann>
now we're talking :)
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<sima>
we generally don't preemptively hack around terribly broken userspace
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<sima>
so yeah if kde is also a case of "displays, but can't change the config" then my vote is on reverting these all again
<jfalempe>
I had to fix a conflict when pushing https://patchwork.freedesktop.org/series/135356/ to drm-misc. I followed the dim documentation, and pushed the resolution. I hope I didn't mess up :)
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<sima>
tzimmermann, there's also the hack to force disable the unwanted output on either cmdline or in sysfs, I guess that should also get mutter back into cooperating
<sima>
so that might be enough to handle anyone reporting this as a regression for an actual user, if it actually ever happens
<sima>
users often tend to be a lot more limited in what they do than exhaustive testing, especially for server platforms
<tzimmermann>
sima, really? so one could disable the bmc output on the command line ?
<sima>
video=OUTPUT:d iirc
<sima>
would need to check docs and test
<tzimmermann>
jfalempe, ^
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<sima>
might also only work for fbcon, but that would stop fbcon from cloning, which might be enough to give mutter something it doesn't understand
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<javierm>
sima: according Documentation/fb/modedb.rst, you are correct on the :d
<sima>
single crtc gpus where kinda en vogue a decade plus ago, not the first time I've had to deploy this hack :-)
<sima>
ok checked the code, forcing output state on the cmdline sets connector->force, i.e. the same thing you also can set through sysfs
<sima>
which means this should work for everything
<sima>
until you change it through sysfs
<jfalempe>
ok, so at least there is a workaround if we report both bmc and vga as connected ?
<tzimmermann>
sima, for cloned outputs, our in-kernel client code picks 1024x768 by default.
<sima>
tzimmermann, hm maybe we should try to fix that then?
<sima>
I thought it's smarter and aims for a common one :-/
<tzimmermann>
jfalempe, the dicussion is now whether we should remove the workaround entirely
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<tzimmermann>
sima, yeah we should try ot fix that
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<tzimmermann>
so at least the kernel works correctly
<sima>
yeah if we can improve fbcon clone enough that it's good enough by default
<sima>
and the hack if anyone really wants working mutter/kde config tool back
<sima>
and there's no black screen, then I think we should ditch the hacks
<tzimmermann>
sima, that sounds at least like a way forward.
<sima>
ok forgot to get some lunch, gtg now, I'll be back in a bit
<tzimmermann>
i can already hear userspace devs curse us
<MrCooper>
pass the fd from drilCreateNewScreen to init_dri2_configs ?
<daniels>
yeah, I was just grepping to see, and it looks like that should work
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<HdkR>
/12
<MrCooper>
this explains why it works with the amdgpu winsys though, it automagically reuses the pre-existing DRM file description internally instead of the one created by eglGetPlatformDisplayEXT
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<eric_engestrom>
zmike: you closed !30227, was that on purpose or a mis-click?
<zmike>
on purpose
<zmike>
I've never misclicked in my life
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<MrCooper>
or explained why you did something :P
<zmike>
I'm not misunderstood, I'm mysterious
<eric_engestrom>
I just saw your comment MrCooper on the other MR, I think you're to blame for that MR being closed :P
<MrCooper>
guilty as charged
<zmike>
I'm struggling and failing at multitasking today
<MrCooper>
well our brains can't really do it, though they make us believe otherwise
<zmike>
mine is very convincing
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<karolherbst>
vsyrjala: I was looking into an EDID related bug for nouveau and noticed, that some stuff might be missing. E.g. it isn't apparent to be if e.g. the errata 2 of CTA-861 was applied. But I'm also not sure if what nvidia is doing maps nicely to how drm declares those things. But more curiously there is some "Resolution Identification" stuff going on I have no idea about. I just saw that you were adding those modes like 5? years ago
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