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<AlienSoldier>
the game Burger Space can mess with the tracker. Back from full screen sometime the tracker is black and no longer refreshing. Killing it get it back to normal. might be something related to the way the game change color depth going full screen
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<Swift110-mobile>
hey Skipp_OSX
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<nephele[m]>
ConditionBoy: you should check out thememanager on haikudepot, it already does color schemes
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* iisi
switches from Lisp and Scheme channels, is confused by "color schemes" for a moment. "Like... Color Forth?! ...Oh."
<ConditionBoy>
nephele[m]: word
<ConditionBoy>
does it do day/night cycles?
<nephele[m]>
Dunno, I haven't checked
<nephele[m]>
apart from implementing dark color scheme support in Haiku completely i am not that interested in themes, hence i havent used it to be honest :)
<nephele[m]>
As for terminal crashing the OS, i have basically never had that, ticket time? I only had one machine that suffered random triple faults, with some now a bit older amd processor (bulldozer or so? 4 physical cores anyhow)
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<ConditionBoy>
i'm not sure it's terminal in particular that's doing it, it's just that it happens while terminal is doing something 99.99% of the time
<ConditionBoy>
could be something only incidentally related to the terminal programmatically, but the connection is there for me
<nephele[m]>
Terminal itself isn't doing much, may just be a process running inside it
<nephele[m]>
do you get a triple fault?
<ConditionBoy>
it's really aggravating, too, because i've been jamming in the terminal pretty much constantly, resulting in about a crash per hour
<ConditionBoy>
thankfully, haiku boots pretty quickly, otherwise i woulkd have long since given up
<ConditionBoy>
though sometimes it boots and refuses to read keystrokes, which means i have to rereboot it
<ConditionBoy>
sometimes even rererereboot it
<ConditionBoy>
nephele[m]: i don't even know what that means
<nephele[m]>
double fault is caught by the OS
<nephele[m]>
triple fault means you are workig and the next second the computer is just off, or you get the boot screen
<ConditionBoy>
then no, i've never gotten a triple fault
<nephele[m]>
just KDL then?
<ConditionBoy>
usually it's just a gradual degredation of the ui, where windows stop updating, then input stops working, and then a complete freeze
<ConditionBoy>
i left one of the freezes running all night once out of curiosity, but it never caught back up to itself
<nephele[m]>
if that happens open the kernel debugger
<ConditionBoy>
now i just force reset once i realise it's happening
<ConditionBoy>
though sometimes, yeah, kdl pops up, assuming that's the kernel debugger
<nephele[m]>
it is, if you get a KDL open a ticket please, otherwise there is not much to be done
<ConditionBoy>
it's just a mess of text to me, anything in particular i should be looking for?
<nephele[m]>
just make a picture and put it on the bugtracker :)
<ConditionBoy>
alright then
<nephele[m]>
if it doesnt display the reason why it stopped you can use the message command
<nephele[m]>
and some kdls can be resumed with continue
<ConditionBoy>
for my part, i'm willing to blame my virtualisation environment, though i wouldn't know why or even if i should
<ConditionBoy>
i did try that
<ConditionBoy>
never amounted to much except what looked to me like another kdl popping up in an endless chain
<nephele[m]>
even if it is the vm its better for haiku to add quirks around it IMO, if we dont it will reflect bad on Haiku no matter how bad the VM
<nephele[m]>
yeah, that happens too :/
<ConditionBoy>
i will try to remember to post on the bug tracker in the future
<ConditionBoy>
if i learn to recognise the same reason repeatedly causing it, i will keep reports to a minimum
<ConditionBoy>
because seriously, it happens *really* often
<nephele[m]>
if its the same kdl no need to open a second ticket, but if you have more info on what caused that you can always add that to an existing ticket
<ConditionBoy>
word
<extrowerk>
ConditionBoy: which Haiku version do you use? There were some regression lately which results in random kernel panics. MAke sure you use the latest nightly.
<extrowerk>
FYI: kernel panic HAVE a prompt, where you can type commands and DONT have a mouse cursor. If yours differs, then it is not a kernel panic.
<nephele[m]>
would be nice if you can open a ticket for the freezes too, a dev more adept at debugging might have more specific pointers what to do then (e.g what info to get from the debugger)
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<ConditionBoy>
extrowerk: i'm updating it right now, but i'm on the nightly repo and last updated a few days go
<ConditionBoy>
though i don't know if that's all there is to it, because it was happening in r1b1
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<AlwaysLivid>
Hah, at least it's good that HaikuUser's are now randomly joining and leaving the channel. Seems like the updates are starting to go through?
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<ConditionBoy>
where should i start looking if i want to change window behavior?
<ConditionBoy>
i think it would be great if middle-clicking a window title acted the same as meta-clicking
<ConditionBoy>
so you could drag windows into and out of stacks and sidecars without having to have your hand on the keyboard
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<nephele[m]>
why would you run beta1?
<nephele[m]>
anyhow, that behaviour is in app_server afaik, i also had a ticket for improving the resizing behaviour in stacks and such (currently it's only semi-usefull imo)
<nephele[m]>
ConditionBoy: the HIG has guidelines for assumed skills the user has, i think dragging with tertiary button was mentioned as not good to use, but maybe its okay as an alternative, you should check the HIG anyhow (cant atm)
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<ConditionBoy>
i don't think it should replace the meta-drag
<ConditionBoy>
just be another way to do the same thing
<Not-b5c9>
[haikuports/haikuports] korli pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JGJMS
<Not-b5c9>
[haikuports/haikuports] korli 72120df - assimp: disable debug build for one big object file
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<ConditionBoy>
not b1, b2, i misspoke
<ConditionBoy>
i also agree that in general, the window operations as curently implemented fail to leverage the concept's full potential
<ConditionBoy>
many of my ideas for improving haiku are focused on drawing out and capitalizing on this radical yet intuitive built-in functionality that is being mostly ignored
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<bitigchi>
ConditionBoy: your changes posted in the mailing list are awesome
<bitigchi>
please continue doing what you are doing
<AlwaysLivid>
wait, i gotta read them
<bitigchi>
it's a great step in standardising Haiku menu structure
<AlwaysLivid>
ConditionBoy, LOVE THAT
<AlwaysLivid>
I need to spend more than 30 seconds re-reading this again but I do love that!
<bitigchi>
it's very Haiku-y, very original
<bitigchi>
not like other OS
<AlwaysLivid>
ConditionBoy, after you do all of this, you may want to put out a guide on how to make the menus more "streamlined" and consistent just so that we can all share the workload, if that's too big of a task
<bitigchi>
agreed, it would be great to update all applications before a release
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<ConditionBoy>
hey guys, thanks for taking a look, i'm glad you like what you see!
<ConditionBoy>
i took the inspiration for my implementation from the parent classes, whilst also adding a few convenience methods to keep it simple to use
<ConditionBoy>
i would love to collaborate on documentation and/or some sort of guide
<ConditionBoy>
i believe a consistent ui is a good ui, so let's all work together to bring haiku to the next level!
<ConditionBoy>
and of course, i look forward to any guidance you all have for me in sharing my ideas and proposals with you all as effectively as possible
<bitigchi>
ConditionBoy: please always share what you have in mind. any activity or proposal is also great motivation for the rest of us, I believe.
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<extrowerk>
ConditionBoy: nice colourtheme you got there.
<extrowerk>
happy to see you got tracker rebuilt
<ConditionBoy>
extrowerk: lol i probably should have changed it back to default for the screenshots
<ConditionBoy>
sometimes i like it firm and fruity
<ConditionBoy>
i didn't spend much time on it, as you can see, but i do find it a lot more readable than the default
<ConditionBoy>
thank you very kindly for your help in getting tracker built and running
<ConditionBoy>
bitigchi: trust me, i'm at no loss for ideas
<extrowerk>
pls install the thememanager program and save this color style and share the result
<ConditionBoy>
sure, i can do that
<ConditionBoy>
i gotta say, i'm not happy with the buttons; there's this dark gradient that gets drawn over them that i didn't spend the time to work around
<ConditionBoy>
how would i share a theme?
<extrowerk>
umm..
<ConditionBoy>
this is neat, i was wondering how to draw different window decorations like the moz-modern one
<extrowerk>
do you happen to have telegram?
<ConditionBoy>
i'll definitely have to check this out
<ConditionBoy>
no, i don't
<ConditionBoy>
i could paste all the color values in pastebin if you're into doing it manually
<nephele[m]>
conditionboy: gradient comes from haikudeecorator
<nephele[m]>
as for the ML, do you have the image normally? personally i would prefer images attached as mime directly, not sure whether the list likes that, but i just cant properly open imgur in any browser, they seem hellbent on making image viewing the worst experience ever ;)
<nephele[m]>
No, i mean the image you share on the ML
<nephele[m]>
shared*
<extrowerk>
ConditionBoy: zip the theme and http://0x0.st/
<ConditionBoy>
the mailing list etiquette said not to do that
<ConditionBoy>
but if you'd prefer me to throw them up somewhere else, i could do that
<nephele[m]>
conditionboy: yes, do you have a normal link though?
<ConditionBoy>
or email them to you directly
<nephele[m]>
email would be fine too if you prefer that
<ConditionBoy>
extrowerk: where are these themes saved?
<extrowerk>
good question.
<nephele[m]>
bitigchi: i think for help system more usage of html is planned, try "git help pull" for instance, in that style or similar it could be done for other commands
<nephele[m]>
but depends a bit who does it how it will look i guess ;)
<ConditionBoy>
nephele[m]: email is fine with me if you want to pm me or something
<ConditionBoy>
but i do like the tab, border, and menu colors
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<nephele[m]>
time to write an email to the author
<nephele[m]>
Ah neat, spleen is merged!
<nephele[m]>
ConditionBoy: mamaged to view the images now
<ConditionBoy>
oh, that's good
<nephele[m]>
to be honest i am okay with having a dedcicated BAppMenu over a generic BMenu for the structure, but then it would save 2 lines of code per app so thats kinda meh again
<nephele[m]>
but i dont like the visual style at all personally :)
<ConditionBoy>
somehow i knew you would say that lol
<ConditionBoy>
i should have changed the colors back to default for the screenshots
<mmu_man>
That reminds me there are still hardcoded paths in the default themes that won't work on Haiku
<nephele[m]>
That won't convince me, I have a pink purple colorscheme myself :p
<mmu_man>
btw, the Theme files are plain text that you can edit
<ConditionBoy>
i have them fruity like that so each ui element was clear, which helped me while figuring out how the system worked to create this appbar
<nephele[m]>
(and i am photophoic so light screenshot are a bit eh to look at)
<ConditionBoy>
so i'm not proposing the colors, just the bar
<ConditionBoy>
also, i should say, it's not about saving time in a text editor as much as it is about establishing consistency
<ConditionBoy>
the fact that it's easy to implement is to encourage its use
<nephele[m]>
Consistency doesn't come from new apis that hide details such as the quit button imo, its more about just enforcing it in generall ;)
<nephele[m]>
the layout kit menu stuff is already really easy to use in my biased opinion, but it's lacking documentation... maybe i should make some as someone who now knows how to use it
<ConditionBoy>
i don't see how this is hiding any details
<nephele[m]>
for layoutkit you would add a .AddAppMenu() call maybe
<nephele[m]>
Well it adds a quit button as a member implicitly, not explicitly visible in code, but its hard to tell exactly how your api looks if you dont have a patch or something published :)
<ConditionBoy>
you can still use that to create the rest of the menus, but the way it works i think it could also be easily integrated into the layout kit
<ConditionBoy>
terminal menus were in layout kit, and it took about 30 seconds to replace the menubar with the appmenubar and add the preferences to the managed appmenu entry
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<ConditionBoy>
i'm kind of gun-shy about sharing a patch this size as my second push
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<nephele[m]>
My first patch i published was a fix for mime types of mp4 files afaik :p
<ConditionBoy>
it's not, strictly-speaking, feature-complete in its current form, but the remaining work is pretty minimal
<ConditionBoy>
and i'm sure the code style will make you gag
<ConditionBoy>
but i appreciate any willing collaborators
<ConditionBoy>
i'm pretty excited about the idea, so i'd love to put it in people's hands for them to play with it themselves
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<ConditionBoy>
nephele[m]: i'd be interested in having a look at your dark theme, by the way
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<countryboy>
hello good people !!! xD
<ConditionBoy>
hello countryboy
<jadedctrl>
hey o/
<countryboy>
hey, love to everybody : np !!!
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<countryboy>
sunny time : later ... ;-)
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<Not-b5c9>
[haikuports/haikuports] korli pushed 1 commit to master [+4/-0/±1] https://git.io/JGUnE
<Not-b5c9>
[haikuports/haikuports] korli 9d1ed1d - qt5: switch 3d quick3d and tools to kde maintenance branch
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<nephele[m]>
conditionboy: most work i did was fix apps that hardcoded colors by now, like aboutsystem, team monitor etc.
<nephele[m]>
i have a wip patch to generate colors based on dark mode pref plus accent color, but its misiing the generation logic yet ;)
<nephele[m]>
also deskcalc needs to be fixed, there is still a review comment waiting for me...
<nephele[m]>
so tldr it's not finished yet, but i shall maybe send an image once i have something to show :)
<leavengood>
I really like the app icon menu. There were definitely some BeOS apps that did that...in fact doesn't Vision? So there is sort of a precedent for this. But making it consistent is nice.
<nephele[m]>
yes vision does this currently
<ConditionBoy>
leavengood: thank you
<ConditionBoy>
i think consistency is key to a good ux
<ConditionBoy>
actually, looking at the source for vision was pretty much where i started with my implementation
<ConditionBoy>
the appmenu icons will scale with menu font size, though
<ConditionBoy>
if anyone has any suggestions on how to proceed with sharing my work, i'm all ears
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<ConditionBoy>
nephele[m]: please do send an image when you're done
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<ConditionBoy>
i determined trying to make a nice-looking dark mode with the color preferences pane alone is pretty much impossible
<ConditionBoy>
so i look forward to seeing what you cooked up
<ConditionBoy>
i know you're photophobic, but ideally for me there would be a way to manage day/night pairs, and an option to have the theme change itself at certain times of day
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<ConditionBoy>
any particular reason the haiku image that is on the desktop by default doesn't have a transparent background?
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<extrowerk>
we were lazy to fix it, probably
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<ConditionBoy>
is the source file hosted somewhere?
<ConditionBoy>
not the image as it appears on the desktop, but rather the project file
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<leavengood>
I and many others really want the low blue light night mode stuff pioneered by flux on MacOS and now most systems have it built in. I think though on most systems is relies on adjusting the gamma curve on the GPU and I don't know how inefficient it might be to do on the CPU.
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<nephele[m]>
ConditionBoy: transparent image in tracker is broken
<nephele[m]>
if you fix that go ahead and give the image some transparency ;?
<nephele[m]>
I don't care about the blue lught filter mode, the science is invredibly sketchy on that, no definitive "this is better"
<nephele[m]>
but i do want a system to allow stuff like that, so we can help UI designers test against color blindness and such
<nephele[m]>
it might be worthwhile to make sure haiku has color calibrated displays before trying to do any funky gamme adjustments ;)
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<bbjimmy>
I installed vision .10.6 but about says .10.3 It seems that the version shown does not match the version installed.
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<B2IA>
(AGMS) Yes, I noticed that. Someone forgot to update a resource or a string somewhere.
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<B2IA>
(bbjimmy_64) I am in the process of moving my beshare server home ... 50.38.112.114 it is up, but my bot is not up yet.
<nephele[m]>
So we have beshare, matrix, irc and xmpp in one room, neat
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<Animortis>
Any new users here? Wanna gauge how things are going
<Animortis>
Of whomever is awake lol
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