<Begasus>
Hello yann-kaelig, hope things are a bit ok there
<yann-kaelig>
I can see the audio PCIe card in the list of the devices, does that mean it's going to work ? It could be a good surprise if it's the case
<yann-kaelig>
The screen size is by default wrong
<yann-kaelig>
No idea how can I change it
<yann-kaelig>
Hello Begasus
<yann-kaelig>
Also I was unable to find an irc software in the list of apps and on the website I can not find a page where there is a list of installed apps with more info about all of them
<yann-kaelig>
I would like to test my MIDI keyboard. Do you know where can I find the list of MIDI and DAW apps for Haiku ?
<Begasus>
To start, default IRC app in Haiku is Vision (long time around)
<yann-kaelig>
Ok, so it seems to be an issue with the VESA driver because resolution show me 1920x1080 which is my screen resolution but the Haiku "workspace" is not full screen
<Begasus>
on Audio, that's tricky, if you're lucky it will work out of the box, some don't have that luck, should be some tips around for checking, but clueless there
<yann-kaelig>
Ok, thank
<yann-kaelig>
Lets try to connect my keyboard using the USB cable
<Begasus>
should be a fair amount of midi apps around
<yann-kaelig>
Do I need to refresh something after I plug and poweron my keyboard ? Where can I find something like dmesg ?
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<Begasus>
maybe you could find some information in syslog (/var/log/syslog)
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<Begasus>
you could run "tail -f /var/log/syslog" when pluggin in/power on the keyboard?
<yann-kaelig>
This is my first test on a baremetal which is something totaly different than a Qemu Testing because it's a real use case.
<Begasus>
speed in running it should be quite a difference too I guess (never ran it in Qemu)
<phschafft>
why?
<Begasus>
I can only speek with experience in running it virtual, well speed in running maybe isn't the right context :)
<Begasus>
building things natively works a lot faster on bare metal for instance
<phschafft>
that is very strange.
<Begasus>
building gcc on this one, bare metal (about an hour), virtual (about 4 hours)
<Habbie>
Begasus, how are you virtualising?
<Begasus>
Hi there Habbie, long time no speak ;)
<Habbie>
hello!
<phschafft>
I'm running full virtual desktops and servers since pentium II times. and I have a hard time to notice any difference (except when you use *very* advanced graphics).
<yann-kaelig>
It's not bad at all, it's responsive but the end-user experience with the Graphical UI is old. Each time I'm trying to move the window I'm clicking on the long gray bar instead of this yellow miniature ^^ It's really difficult to switch from on to other windows. The menu I want to be honest is a mess.
<Begasus>
I had been using VBox on Ubuntu in the past, on this one with Windows11 I use VMWare
<yann-kaelig>
There is a lot of work to modernised the dekstop UI, it should be
<phschafft>
specifically everything that only uses CPU and RAM should run at basically the same speed as the virtualisation is not doing anything at all.
<phschafft>
and as for block device access, I hardly see much bottleneck. I mean it more or less just forwards raw read and write requests between virtual and host block devices.
<Begasus>
phschafft, in virtual when I check out larger projects I make sure not much more then needed is running, so it only should use CPU and RAM
<phschafft>
hm.
<yann-kaelig>
The Home > Dekstop > Home > Desktop > Home > Desktop is funny ^^
<Begasus>
granted, I can't fully add all resources to the virtual machine (half of the CPU's, limited RAM to 8GB)
<phschafft>
I would say that having a bit of extra RAM for compiling surely makes a difference (for the disk cache). also good set of build files can make a big difference (which in your case are the same, no not relevant here).
<phschafft>
Begasus: really, I'm just a bit confused. that's all. in no way trying to invalidate what you see on your own systems.
<Begasus>
np phschafft, only personal experience here, no harm done :)
<phschafft>
also when we share what our problems are we can grow on them together.
<Begasus>
+1 there
<phschafft>
hm.
<Begasus>
I just count myself lucky to have this build setup atm, so pretty pleased :D
<phschafft>
do you forward different CPU options to the guest than the host has?
<phschafft>
I noticed long long ago that gcc can be sensitive to that.
<phschafft>
as in it switches between different code paths internal depending on the CPU it is running on (not to be confused with the CPU it is building for)
<yann-kaelig>
Well, that was pretty interesting. Porting the Hammerfall Multiface II / PCIe card / MAUDIO MIDI driver should not be too difficult for a Dev I suppose, everything is available on Linux. Don't know what is the state of DAW/MIDI softwares on Haiku. Porting a software in my opinion is less interesting than a native Haiku software development. At least it could show the state of Haiku as an audio workstation.
<phschafft>
(not relevant here, but I got some MIDI test hardware for our lab recently.)
<yann-kaelig>
Right now I do not see the added value of Haiku which is supposed to be a multimedia OS, look like it not the principal direction of Haiku.
<yann-kaelig>
By multimedia I mean Audio / Video / MIDI production workstation
<Begasus>
phschafft, no idea how to do that, just using default options in vmware
<yann-kaelig>
But anyway, good job, it's working on my computer :)
<phschafft>
yann-kaelig: :)
<yann-kaelig>
Well, next AROS ^^
<phschafft>
trying a number of systems?
<yann-kaelig>
Yep, just before cleaning my hard-drive precisely in order to use my current system for Audio / Video / MIDI prod.
* phschafft
nods.
<yann-kaelig>
And I don't expect AROS to work, I'll see. An Aimga OS Like on my x86_64, that coudl be funny ^^
<yann-kaelig>
As an old Amiga 500 user
<phschafft>
this year I'm again back into the depths of how I think a computer should work.
<phschafft>
it connects to some other research I do at work.
<phschafft>
also I find myself often going back to ideas I had when I was way younger.
<phschafft>
bit of geting the perspective of someone who doesn't know how things work but wants to know with someone who knows what is possible and all the strange side tracks we got ourselfs on.
<yann-kaelig>
On the subject of a modern desktop I believe that Arcan the project lays the foundations of what will be the futur. For a long time even before this project I was thinking that an engine should be used. To my surprise someone made a dream a reality :)
<phschafft>
?
<yann-kaelig>
And a modern computer should be 100 % open-source like the Talos II
<yann-kaelig>
Ok, thank you all, CU later :)
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<Begasus>
bugger ... missed the error on trying to build gccgo ...
<Begasus>
biab
<phschafft>
hm.
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<kallisti5[m]>
Ok. Collecting opinions... Dual monitors + Full size desktop, or dual monitors + laptop with a Thunderbolt 3 GPU dock?
<kallisti5[m]>
I'm probably showing my age preferring a full sized desktop lol.
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<kallisti5[m]>
I think the biggest risks of laptop + thunderbolt 3 dock is instability (I seem to always run into random issues docking / etc) Also Haiku likely won't be doing TB3 anytime soon... so i'm limited to laptop-only mode there 🤔
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<x512[m]>
kallisti5: > Also Haiku likely won't be doing TB3 anytime soon
<x512[m]>
Why not?
<x512[m]>
Thunderbolt seems the same thing as USB 4.
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<kallisti5[m]>
x512: the whole PCI bus extension thing is kinda tricky
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<kallisti5[m]>
adding new roots, etc
<kallisti5[m]>
though... I think some of your recent PCI work will help?
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<x512[m]>
Basically hot plug PCI to PCI bridge?
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<kallisti5[m]>
yeah. But you gotta hotplug everything behind the bridge as well
<kallisti5[m]>
GPU's , etc
<kallisti5[m]>
and our app server definitely isn't ready for that lol
<kallisti5[m]>
non-hotplug may be doable though
<x512[m]>
Dynamic resource allocator should not be a big problem (it is already implemented in some limited way and not integrated to generic PCI bus manager yet).
<x512[m]>
It may be needed to implement PCI device lock by drivers to allow dynamic resource reassign while driver is running.
<x512[m]>
Lock device -> driver stops accessing to PCI BARs etc -> reassign PCI BARs -> unlock device -> resume access to PCI BARs by driver
<nielx[m]>
Begasus: hello! #
<nielx[m]>
I was away for the weekend, I saw the message that emacs is now building?
<nielx[m]>
How did you manage that?
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<augiedoggie>
i patched emacs to avoid running the 'be-resources' command
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<nielx[m]>
right :-)
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<Begasus>
nielx[m], should be ready to merge then I guess :)
<nielx[m]>
I guess so. I am contemplating if we are going all the way and mark it as tested, so that the builders pick it up
<Begasus>
I'll leave that up to you, I'm not sure in what way this would take it's course on building Haiku
<nielx[m]>
I think I have almost everything on the Haiku side ready... except for updating the build package repostories. Let's get this merged as is, I will do another PR when I am confident I can get that to work
<Begasus>
+1 for me, I think you can merge too?
<nielx[m]>
I am not sure I can in the haikuports org
<botifico-e32c8fbd>
[haikuports/haikuports] nielx 3be1343 - GCC 13: add gcc_jit and other fixes (#9058)
<Begasus>
Thanks for the patience from my side :)
<nielx[m]>
Thanks for helping out, really. This is a big bit of work with a lot of impact so it was very helpful to have an extra set of eyes onthem
<Begasus>
Team effort :)
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<B2IA>
(AGMS) Finally got around to it and updated B2IA BeShare to IRC bridge to R1B4, and fixed dead connection Vision restarts to do it more automatically.
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<AGMS>
Looks like that worked, does it send text to BeShare from IRC?
<Begasus>
testing ... :)
<B2IA>
(AGMS) Yup, works! Time to try a dead network connection (by rebooting the firewall so it forgets the connection)....
<Begasus>
biab
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<B2IA>
(Butler) Welcome to BeShare.agmsmith.ca.
<B2IA>
(AGMS) Hmmm, sort of half worked, will see what happens in practice with the 3am network disconnections. Anyway, back to normal or perhaps better than normal!
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<zard>
Ooh, first KDL.
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<Anarchos>
Does haiku have a getrandom or getentropy C function ?
<andreasdr>
x512: may I ask politely if there is some 3d hw update?
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<andreasdr>
I think EV_ADD and EV_ENABLE, EV_DISABLE are there to not require to remove entries from a kqueue array, but disable and enable them to avoid some memcpy. Just a guess :DDD
<andreasdr>
Just a guess.
<andreasdr>
:DDD
<andreasdr>
And if a client and its fd disappears you finally do EV_DELETE
<andreasdr>
No worries, kqueue seems to be very old, but good.
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