marcan changed the topic of #asahi to: Asahi Linux: porting Linux to Apple Silicon macs | "Does XXX work yet?": https://alx.sh/fs | GitHub: https://alx.sh/g | Wiki: https://alx.sh/w | Topics: #asahi-dev #asahi-re #asahi-gpu #asahi-alt #asahi-stream #asahi-offtopic | Keep things on topic | Logs: https://alx.sh/l/asahi
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<whyirc>
I'm kinda confused with what arm extensions does m1 (is pro/max different? is m2 different? is m2 pro/max?). Wikipedia says that it's ARMv8.5 (so it should support juicy security stuff like MTE), but wikichip says that it is only v8.4
<whyirc>
So my question boils down to: does m1 support arm memory tagging? branch target identification? Is m2 different?
<_jannau__>
whyirc: MTE is optional in armv8.5
<_jannau__>
m1 and m2 differ. Mx and Mx Pro/Max do not differ, their cores share the same micro arch
<whyirc>
Is there any sources that i can look myself to learn more about this?
<chadmed>
whyirc: m2 and up support BTI iirc
<_jannau__>
m2 supports BTI, nested virtualisation and some other additional features
<whyirc>
So m1 doesn't support nested virtualisation?
<_jannau__>
whyirc: the Arm architecture reference manual. see chapter A2 "Armv8-A Architecture Extensions"
<psykose>
there's definitely a bunch of required stuff for 8.5
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<_jannau__>
psykose: llvm differentiates between arch extensions and cpu features. the mandatory new armv8.5-a features like bti/m2/frintts have just feature flags
<psykose>
ah
<_jannau__>
at least for some of them like bti I can understand why they are not turned on by default for armv8.5-a based CPUs, for others I can only assume they are trying to save bits. the arch extensions is a 64-bit bitmask and almost full
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<kettenis>
I also believe there is an attempt to stay aligned with GCC
<kettenis>
although in this case the GCC docs say that armv8.5a = armv8.4a +sb +ssbs +predres
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<kettenis>
anyway, I think ARM just messed this up completely and the architecture levels are mostly meaningless marketing bullshit
<_jannau__>
gcc man page says that sb, ssbs, predres do not affect code generation just instruction availability for the assembler
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<mooad_dib>
greetings hackers, is there a way to try asahi without installing it? I'm on a macbook air m1 2020 and a bit afraid of biting the bullet
<gill6151>
if you have the free space to do so, you can install it alongside macos and then just delete the partitions afterwards if you decide you dont want it
<_jannau__>
mooad_dib: no, the installing is always necessary. even when full usb storage support is implemented, there will be still an install step
<mooad_dib>
I believe I do have the space, but I'm not really sure I'm reading the mac disk util output correctly
<waldi>
mooad_dib: the installer will try to make some free space for you
<mooad_dib>
not sure I'm reading the hardware supported page correctly either, can anybody confirm/deny external monitors work (with/without dongle), usb keyboards, mice, webcams?
<mooad_dib>
I'm seeing a '-' on the support page for USB A, not sure if it means doesn't work or the more plain mac book air doesn't have a USB A port
<chadmed>
the macbook air does not have a usb-a port
<waldi>
mooad_dib: if you have one, may try to find the usb a port?
<mooad_dib>
I'm asking to expect with Macbook air and USB A via dongle
<gill6151>
usb a via dongle is not the same as "usb a"
<mooad_dib>
I know there's no actual USB A on the air :D
<gill6151>
that is just usb c
<mooad_dib>
ah, that's gill, that was what I meant
<gill6151>
as for external monitors, it depends how you want to connect them
<gill6151>
AFAIK the native display output works, but displaylink does not yet
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<gill6151>
dp alt mode is what im waiting for before installing asahi
<mooad_dib>
I need both, as I move around between dp monitors and hdmi monitors
<mooad_dib>
so I guess I'll be waiting a while too, thanks!
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<sven>
on the air no external display works
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<sven>
unless you use something that exposes a framebuffer via normal usb but that’s generally not a great solution
<mooad_dib>
yeah no, that's a showstopper for me, thanks
<nsklaus_>
i was wondering if the devs currently have support for keyboard and trackpad on m2pro laptop ?
<nsklaus_>
or instead if currently all of them use external kerboard and mouse at the moment ?
<nsklaus_>
*keyboard
<gill6151>
have you bothered looking at the feature support list?
<nsklaus_>
yes ?
<nsklaus_>
let me look again
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<nsklaus_>
it says linux-asahi
<j`ey>
it's the same as the non-pro m2 i believe
<gill6151>
yes, the keyboard and trackpad work under the linux-asahi kernel
<nsklaus_>
meaning it should be in base kernel
<nsklaus_>
but i installed asahi here on my m2pro laptop, and it boot straight to graphical installer, it boots, i have image on screen but from there mouse and keyboard are completely unresponsive
<nsklaus_>
so, i cannot finish graphical installer, but thanksfully power button works to shutdown niely
<nsklaus_>
nicely
<gill6151>
by m2 pro do you mean, m2 macbook pro or m2 pro/max macbook pro
<nsklaus_>
i mean macbook pro, 14", 2023, m2pro cpu
<gill6151>
if the feature support list is anything to go by, then barely anything works anyways at the moment, including the main display and shit
<gill6151>
even the installer is listed as WIP
<nsklaus_>
display seem to work fine, i can see grub, boot console log, then graphical installer
<nsklaus_>
and feature-support page seem to indicate my specific laptop should have support for keyboard and trackpad from base linux-asahi kernel
<gill6151>
idk
<_jannau__>
the m2 pro/max devices are not yet supported. keyboard support in u-boot breaks the device so it's unuseable in linux
<nsklaus_>
thanks for telling _jannau__
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<nsklaus_>
what would be the best steps next for me, erase asahi then wait for m2pro support to get merged and do a complete install again ?
<nsklaus_>
bah, nm, that's not important i'll figure something out
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<_jannau__>
a fixed u-boot should be available before the devices are fully supported. patches are available. a re-install will be required for display/gpu support since we will only support firmware from different macos version
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<nsklaus_>
_jannau__: thanks for these details
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<nsklaus_>
out of curiosity, is there any way i could apply these patch myself ?
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<csumpasd>
hi!
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<csumpasd>
does this work? have i managed to connect?
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<lflde>
hey, quick question; was wondering, is there a way to live boot asahi linux without installing it?
<dottedmag>
lflde: no
<lflde>
ah, I see, got it, thanks; also if I may ask, how are the temperatures overall compared to Mac while doing basic browsing stuff? (like Discord + Chrome opened)
* dottedmag
wonders if it's a good idea to add a bot that greets every new username with "Asahi can't be live-booted"
<maz>
dottedmag: we seem to get that question every 5 hour or so...
<dottedmag>
exactly
<lflde>
I think it'd be a fair addition to put it plain and simple on the actual site
<lflde>
if a lot of people come into this IRC channel to ask this, it's either that the information is too hard to find on the site or it's not there, in that case it's fair to expect people asking this many times
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<maz>
well, there is tons of "plain and simple" things that could be advertised. bizarrely, some of us prefer focusing on writing code...
<lflde>
I know, only thing I'm trying to say is that I did try looking up on google & on the website, couldn't find any info hence why I came here to ask, I don't think it's necessarily crazy that this is also why so many people ask the same question, I was only suggesting a change
<maz>
lflde: feel free to propose an update to the documentation.
<dottedmag>
lflde: Right, the documentation is in the github repo, please add a short paragraph where you'd expect to find it and open a PR?
<lflde>
alright, I'll do that once I get home
<maz>
cheers.
<lflde>
so if I may ask, how are the temperatures overall compared to Mac while doing basic browsing stuff? (like Discord + Chrome opened for example)
<gill6151>
kia ora, just wondering if asahi linux can be live booted?
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<dottedmag>
lflde: I'm not sure anyone actually measured
<lflde>
I see okay thanks
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<kaazoo>
Hi, in case anybody here using or interested in ZFS: I was facing some armv7 assembly problems on 6.3.0-7-asahi-edge. Seems like the zfs kernel module tries to use armv7 assembly that might have worked on other aarch64 systems so far, but fails on Apple Silicon: https://github.com/openzfs/zfs/issues/14862
<nicolas17>
wtf
<nicolas17>
that's like "the i386 assembly is crashing on my x86_64 kernel"
<nicolas17>
how does that even compile?
<opticron>
yeah...it shouldn't
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<opticron>
and the assembly isn't similar enough for it to accidentally assemble and link
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<nicolas17>
as far as I can tell, this code is buggy and should give you a linker error
<nicolas17>
you already mentioned a few "oh I actually changed that to make it work" in the issue, what *else* did you change and didn't mention yet? :P
<psykose>
why would it give a linker error
<nicolas17>
looks like "transform = zfs_sha256_block_armv7" is under "#elif defined(__aarch64__) || (defined(__arm__) && __ARM_ARCH > 6)"
<nicolas17>
the definition of zfs_sha256_block_armv7 is in sha256-armv7.S
<nicolas17>
afaict, the build system doesn't include that file under arm64
<nicolas17>
in which case it should say undefined symbol zfs_sha256_block_armv7
<nicolas17>
if I'm misunderstanding the build system and it *does* build that file, it should fail to assemble anyway
<psykose>
i'd guess CONFIG_ARM64 includes ARM implicitly or something
<nicolas17>
in that case, wouldn't it pass sha256-armv7.S to the arm64 assembler and fail?
<nicolas17>
or assemble it as armv7 and then fail to link due to incompatible .o architectures?
<loading>
I'm really not sure if it's an asahi issue or not but
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<bluetail>
loading I'm also having a question regarding an issue I'm having. Theres a user called loading and that user asks about asking a question and I cannot see what their question is
<loading>
someone threw a bot in chat. excellent
<loading>
anyway
<bluetail>
no that was a do not ask to ask ref...
<loading>
the issue is that sudo periodically stops working, claiming that I'm using an incorrect password. I've verified that I am not by checking the shadow file and reproducing the hash
<loading>
initially the issue was solved by reinstalling pambase (pacman -S pambase)
<loading>
the second time it happened I had to restart the system all together since reinstalling didn't work
<loading>
bluetail, I was just being nice and leading into the issue. I didn't ask if I could ask
<loading>
sorry if that was annoying to you
<bluetail>
loading running into that too. What helps is faillock --user blu --reset
<bluetail>
but for my case it's cause I mistype I think
<loading>
I'll have to try that... I wonder why it would lock me out though. I don't mistype that often
<loading>
it worked!!
<loading>
I was able to lock myself out and then regain access... Thanks for teaching me something
<loading>
I'm not sure how I never ran into that after so many years on linu