ChanServ changed the topic of #haiku to: Open-source operating system that specifically targets personal computing. | https://haiku-os.org | Nightlies: https://download.haiku-os.org | Bugtracker: https://dev.haiku-os.org | SCM: https://git.haiku-os.org/ | Logs: https://oftc.irclog.whitequark.org/haiku | Matrix: #haiku:matrix.org | XMPP: #haiku%irc.oftc.net@irc.jabberfr.org
<waddlesplash> yes, but they at least have all the BSD patches intree
<Nephele> and it is also not toooo sure they will even survive with the recent antitrust suite
<waddlesplash> nah, it will survive, one way or another
<Nephele> maybe it will become a proper community project again :P
<waddlesplash> if Mozilla dies, Firefox will get reborn yet again as a community project
<waddlesplash> yeah
<waddlesplash> maybe it will become possible to donate to Firefox development again...
<Nephele> maybe that would not be too bad an outcome
<Nephele> no crypto scams, forced advertising... an open webrowser xD
<Nephele> i was quite amused at jwz insulting mozilla on twitter for accepting crypto donations
<Nephele> waddlesplash: speaking of browsers, i think the netsurf native chrome could use some love
<waddlesplash> everything around here could "use some love"
<waddlesplash> we are building an OS with pennies and sweat
<Nephele> Me too! :D
<waddlesplash> lol
<Nephele> well, curently you get the most pennies
<waddlesplash> yes, I do
<Nephele> :)
<waddlesplash> but they're still pennies compared to what OS devs at MS or Apple get paid :P
<Nephele> clearly you chose the wrong profession
<waddlesplash> I think the Haiku community would not agree with you :-p
<Nephele> I actually looked at how safari performs on apples new platform two days ago, they redesigned the scrollbar in a good way. but still autohide it
<waddlesplash> but yes, it is very impressive how much we can do with our "pennies and sweat"
<Skipp_OSX> more than most do
<Nephele> indeed
<waddlesplash> the pittance of "man-hours" poured into Haiku compared to Linux, and yet for a variety of usecases we are a real competitor to desktop Linux
<waddlesplash> and the gap is, slowly, closing
<Nephele> But i think this is because we talk to each other, and don't develop 20 alternatives and let the user "choose"
<Skipp_OSX> well I'm happy, assuming we get the download in Web+ bug solved, and I'm pretty sure it already is.
<Nephele> it is for 64bit yeah
<Nephele> 32bit apparently doesn't build but PulkoMandy wanted to investigate that
<Nephele> but ran into trouble with git
<Nephele> I want to properly set up my webkit build server with haiku again :(
<Nephele> waddlesplash: i sure wish it would boot with mbr for framebuffer
<waddlesplash> ?
<Nephele> but barring that, maybe somebody has a recomendation for "some" graphics card pci-e i can use for native resolution
<Nephele> well, mbr boot is broken on that machine
<Nephele> and efi gives me a trashy resolution
<waddlesplash> what resolutions does the bootloader offer?
<waddlesplash> EFI can change resolutions, just not after boot services exited
<waddlesplash> so, check what the bootloader has in the modelist
<Nephele> uhh, i think a trashy one only
<waddlesplash> just one? really?
<waddlesplash> weird
<Nephele> i can check though
<waddlesplash> you can also try the VESA settings file
<Nephele> one moment
<waddlesplash> the EFI loader does read this and tries to set that mode
<Nephele> but this efi has given me lots of trouble in the past
<waddlesplash> ah
<Nephele> if you disable cms you won't even get video output for some reason
<waddlesplash> Skipp_OSX: yeah, at this point, we need WebKit fix, and then Userguide sync, and that's it
<waddlesplash> so, I should work on the release notes
<Skipp_OSX> I opened up the contract reports and monthly updates to get a gist... but there's a lot
<Skipp_OSX> I have updated release notes a bit on trac... maybe you see my 256MB min change and will be mad.
<Nephele> huh? wasn't it more in the previous release?
<Nephele> 364mbß
<Nephele> ?
<Skipp_OSX> yeah that's why he's be mad
<Nephele> well if you tested it and it works that should be fine
<Skipp_OSX> yep, and it didn't before
<Skipp_OSX> so something got improved
<Nephele> on a related note, i am happy of not having any recent packagefs sucks discussions in the forum
<Skipp_OSX> who needs package management when you can just unzip a directory of files on top of home?
<waddlesplash> shh... don't jinx it
<waddlesplash> :P
<waddlesplash> nephele: I have a WIP change to reduce packagefs memory usage by 40 bytes per file visible on the filesystem
<waddlesplash> didn't get it in to beta5 because it's a bit dangerous and needs more work
<Nephele> that's ridicilous, just delete some files >:( /s
<Skipp_OSX> 40 bytes, what is this bloatware?
<Skipp_OSX> (hehe)
<waddlesplash> no, 40 bytes *per file*
<Skipp_OSX> oh I suppose memory just grows on trees where you're from
<waddlesplash> if you have 2000 installed files, it'll save 78 MB
<waddlesplash> etc.
<Skipp_OSX> yeah, cool.
<Nephele> I want less installed files sometimes
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<Nephele> but quite good a change indeed
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<Nephele> most of my memory keeps getting consumed my webkit memory leaks though
<Skipp_OSX> yeah of course
<Nephele> waddlesplash: one cool thing to add would be to, like FreeBSD, reject writing to a device file that contains a mounted filesystem
<waddlesplash> that would be nice
<waddlesplash> we have some other bugs around exclusive access
<waddlesplash> to open devices. but that's another storyt
<Nephele> though currently if you unmount both filesystems on my flash drive it dissapears from the device tree and i dunno why
<Nephele> so i have to keep it mounted to write to it which is silly
<Nephele> also stealing SIGINFO would be cool :D
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<waddlesplash> hmm, does only FreeBSD have that, or do others?
<Nephele> linux has it on *some* obscure cpu arch, i think the other BSDs have it too and illumos or so? not too sure about illumos
<Nephele> but i know gnu coreutils has some support for it
<Nephele> linux has it on alpha if i read this correctly
<jhj> I'd love Haiku to support psdanger/SIGDANGER like AIX has - https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/aix/7.3?topic=p-psdanger-subroutine
<Nephele> lol FreeBSDfoundation made a PDF about SIGINFO: https://freebsdfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/SIGINFO-Stay-in-the-Dark.pdf
<jhj> If the system is under memory pressure, you get a SIGDANGER, which you can choose to handle, usually taking a memory saving action or saving your work in case of a crash.
<Nephele> jhj: that's silly, just kill the process that has the longest time on low memory. Like the X11 server ;)
<Nephele> waddlesplash: yeah i'm getting 1024x768 and 800x600
<jhj> hah
<Nephele> the card is also a nvidia card currently inserted, so no chance for drivers on that one
<Nephele> but the bios loader freezes with native resolution :D
<Nephele> freebsd extended filesystem flags like undeleteable (by root) are also quite cool, you can protect special files with it
<Nephele> but probably harder to add to bfs
<phschafft> why?
<Nephele> phschafft: compared to not modifying the disk format :)
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<Nephele> I'd assume ufs2 is designed with those flags in mind
<phschafft> I mean they are just a set of bits in the inode.
<jhj> Linux has that too
<jhj> chattr, etc.
<phschafft> but you could just use an extented attribute. ;)
<Nephele> jhj: isn't that just extended attributes though?
<jhj> I don't know how they are implemented.
<Nephele> no i ment chattr
<jhj> I ise +i for immutable often
<Nephele> ah, no it indeed is similar
<Nephele> nevermind
<jhj> It's also useful to disable atime on a fine grained basis
<jhj> You can also set files to be case insensitive
<jhj> (depending on the filesystem)
<phschafft> I think it's very similar between Linux and FreeBSD.
<Nephele> is signals a kernel ticket or libroot? hmm
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<phschafft> hm?
<Nephele> jhj: hard to wrap my head around making it case insensitive beeing the hard complex case, from a user perspective it sounds like "One less thing to worry about" xD
<waddlesplash> jhj: SIGDANGER/psdanger looks like a userspace version of what in Haiku is the kernel low_resource system
<waddlesplash> looks linteresting
<jhj> AIX has all sorts of extensions like that.
<Nephele> added a ticket for SIGINFO https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/19026
<Nephele> hmm, wasn't there some hardware DB i could check for supported gpus for haiku
<jhj> waddlesplash: a way to ask running processes to try to clean up for themselves (before invoking an OOM killer) is just polite.
<Nephele> I agree, but on Haiku that also is less relevant because we don't overcommit by default
<waddlesplash> jhj: we don't have an OOM killer
<jhj> It could be used to kill backgrounded tabs sitting open on a browser for example.
<waddlesplash> apps that request overcommitted memory are expected to deal with SIGSEGV themselves
<jhj> I know, just, in general :)
<Nephele> Well telling the browser, and it deciding this for itself, sounds much better to me than just shooting a process somewhere
<jhj> exactly
<Nephele> it can neatly store it's content even and restore the state if it wants
<jhj> For a browser, also dumping any memory cache, etc.
<Nephele> I kind of want a BColumnListView in team monitor and some generic cpu% mem% tabs
<jhj> I can see a lot of potentially friendly behaviors
<Nephele> Indeed
<Nephele> waddlesplash: mind making a ticket for this one? I'm not too versed in our memory system, I think you can add more relevant info here :)
<Nephele> Skipp_OSX: how hard would it be to implement alpha channel support for trackers desktop mode background images?
<phschafft> I mean there is memory pressure. as in if you run low on memory (or swap) it might be worth to let applications store stuff in an application specific way and drop memory. it will most likely be better than to swap random pages.
<phschafft> but I also think software should use stuff like madvise() some more.
<Nephele> ah yes, discussions about HaikuOS are what i needed instead of packagekit .-.
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<Skipp_OSX> alpha is possible...
<Skipp_OSX> how hard? Well, not hard, but not implemented yet.
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<Skipp_OSX> (unfortunately they are all really hard to fix)
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<jhj> Oh, speaking of useful signals, Sun has SIGPWR (and I think Linux does too but it terminates by default, or,it used to)
<jhj> The idea is on power failure a UPS monitoring daemon sends SIGPWR to notify of the power failure, and processes can do something special to temporarily reduce their power usage and/or save user data.
<jhj> It's hampered because there wasnt ever any corresponding "power restored" signal.
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<AlienSoldier> latest qtwebengine broke falcon. Id that not the point of a package manager to manage dependency?
<AlienSoldier> *is
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<jhj> These days that functionality has been taken up by watching power events on dbus or what not, on linux
<jhj> AlienSoldier: I'd make an issue just in case, but I'm sure it wasnt intentional :/
<AlienSoldier> i am glad it is worked on at least, facebook messenger is not working reliably with it. Web+ a bit better but can't rplay audio message.
<AlienSoldier> web epiphany is also still broken.
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<Begasus> g'morning peeps
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<Begasus> k, cought up on logs
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus pushed 1 commit to master [+2/-2/±0] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/c1bc08d4cc6d...33486c58e3fd
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus 33486c5 - podofo, bump version (also openssl3 issue) (#10984)
<Begasus> one annoying thing, my Tracker window closes when I pull/push from my fork and only 1 file is involved :)
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<OscarL> after updating the patchset... launched hp "virtualbox_guess_additions-7.0.20"... didn't got too far before first error :-(
<OscarL> missing "#include <netdb.h>" somewhere, for starters.
<Begasus> ouch: /sources/cmake-3.28.3/Utilities/cmlibarchive/libarchive/archive_random.c:54:13: error: static declaration of 'arc4random_buf' follows non-static declaration
<Begasus> Hi OscarL
<OscarL> morning Begasus!
<Begasus> k, this worked before, what happened with "'arc4random_buf'"?
<OscarL> I think madmax got that error too with miss-detected arc4random.
<OscarL> might be missing some "#include <features.h>" or something?
<OscarL> for one of those _DEFAULT_SOURCE (or _GNU_SOURCE) things that I never fully understood :-)
<Begasus> let's first try with _GNU_SOURCE
<Begasus> why isn't there some default value for this? it's the second one this week I hit for this
<OscarL> arc4random is "from BSD", IIRC, so _GNU_SOURCE might not be it :-)
<Begasus> right, wasn't it :)
<OscarL> I see _BSD_SOURCE on "headers/bsd/features.h"
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<Begasus> isn't detected when checking it seems: CHECK_FUNCTION_EXISTS_GLIBC(arc4random_buf HAVE_ARC4RANDOM_BUF)
<OscarL> "#include <features.h>" while having "develop/headers/bsd" in the include path might work? (from what I read on posix/features.h)
<Begasus> tried ... didn't work also
<OscarL> Begasus: from "bsd/stdlib.h"... it uses "#ifdef _DEFAULT_SOURCE"
<OscarL> :-(
<OscarL> sorry for not being more helpfull, never understood this mess :-)
<Begasus> np, thanks for thinking along :)
<Begasus> I had this working on beta4
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/33486c58e3fd...e483bd102c6d
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus e483bd1 - scribus, revbump for openssl3 (#10987)
<OscarL> heh, my problem with h_errno in vbox-ga... needs _DEFAULT_SOURCE defined somewere.
<jhj> Begasus: can you fix pigz?
<jhj> pigz: abort: zlib version less than 1.2.3
<Begasus> don't know jhj, is it broken?
<jhj> it just needs to be rebuilt
<Begasus> looks like qtwebengine is borked on 32bit?
<jhj> (against a zlib bump)
<Begasus> nexcloud-client fails to launch
<Begasus> added in todo list jhj if no one beats me to it :)
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<jhj> thx
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<phschafft> good morning.
<OscarL> morning phschafft.
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* phschafft waves to OscarL, then refills the cookie bowl before finding some spot that is a bit dim to just sit down for a bit.
<OscarL> Begasus: Pete donated his nice Cscound vector icon. Says he was too lazy to CC you :-D
* OscarL didn't know where to try adding -D_DEFAULT_SOURCE, so he just exported both CFLAGS and CXXFLAGS, and hopes it works.
<Begasus> np OscarL, thanks for picking it up
<Begasus> g'morning phschafft
<Begasus> k, let's try the default cmake recipe ...
<Begasus> arghh! [Errno -2147459069] No such file or directory: '/Opslag/haikuports/repository/cmake_gui-3.28.3.DependencyInfo'
<OscarL> export CXXFLAGS didn't worked. :-/
<OscarL> Begasus: time to nuke "repository" ? :-D
<OscarL> I had to do so after switching from master to beta5 proper.
<Begasus> k, current one fails with same error
<Begasus> just nuked the 2 files for cmake in there OscarL :)
<OscarL> nice when that works :-)
<OscarL> waiting for all the dep files to be re-generated is no fun :-D
<Begasus> checking new cmake version ...
* OscarL adds "#define _DEFAULT_SOURCE" at the top of the affected file, like a proper caveman.
<Begasus> been there ;)
<OscarL> /bin/kmk at least is polite: "Please use KBUILD_TYPE instead of BUILD_TYPE" :-)
<Begasus> heh
<OscarL> mmm. this next error will be tough: 'error: #error "PORTME"'
<Begasus> would be nice if those patches got upstream instead of dealing each time with those
<Begasus> heh
<Begasus> missin OS support?
<OscarL> didn't had that error with 7.0.4... that's what I get for trying to use the newest version :-D
<Begasus> not pushing to new version if not needed here for the moment
<Begasus> but maybe for cmake it's needed, or someone would find a sollution for the failure
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* OscarL slaps a "|| defined(RT_OS_HAIKU) \", and makes some coffee.
<OscarL> mmm, problems with "d_name" in struct dirent... I've seen this one before a couple of times on other recipes.
<OscarL> we have a few patches for that, IIRC.
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<hsp> How can I delete the downloaded packages after an upgrade or package installation? In other words, release the disk space again?
<Begasus> hsp, delete administrative states in /system/packages
<Begasus> but be carefull not to delete them (eg use at own risk) :)
<Begasus> to the delete them all*
<Begasus> multiple patches for that OscarL
<Begasus> OscarL! grabbing cmake-3.28.3-2-x86_64.hpkg and moving it to /Opslag/haikuports/packages/cmake-3.28.3-2-x86_64.hpkg
<Begasus> :D
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<OscarL> hsp: but as Begasus said... before removing them all, make sure your system is working fine (so you don't need to go back to those old states)
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<Begasus> mostly before I do it I do a reboot to be sure to boot with latest changes
<OscarL> Begasus: nice!, do the VBox guest additions next! :-)
<Begasus> and keep the last month around
<Begasus> nah OscarL, not in my list atm :P
<Begasus> have to be sure it's operational eg also testing on 32bit
<Begasus> had to use CPPFLAGS and LDFLAGS to get it to build
<Begasus> bugger, now I can't use nexcloud to share files :/
* OscarL adds another "#define _DEFAULT_SOURCE" :-/
<Begasus> export CPPFLAGS="_GNU_SOURCE"
<Begasus> export LDFLAGS="-lbsd"
<Begasus> tried that?
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<Begasus> hi jmairboeck
<jmairboeck> Hi Begasus
<OscarL> this one needs _DEFAULT_SOURCE, tried with export first, no go... and... I just want to make it compile first, then make it better :-D
<OscarL> good day jmairboeck :-)
<jmairboeck> OscarL: the proper way to deal with _DEFAULT_SOURCE, _GNU_SOURCE etc is the -std compiler flag: when using -std=c++11 or something, you don't get them. You need -std=gnu++11, or no -std at all.
<jmairboeck> so if something in the build system sets -std, I think the easiest would be to patch that
<OscarL> jmairboeck: will keep that in mind, thanks!
<jmairboeck> or the equivalent for C without the ++
<OscarL> problem is... this thing uses "kbuild", those .mk are pretty large, and as usual... I barely know what I'm doing :-)
<OscarL> (context: virtualbox_guest_additions)
<Begasus> if(CMAKE_SYSTEM_NAME MATCHES "^(Linux)$" OR "Haiku")
<Begasus> add_definitions(-D_DEFAULT_SOURCE -D_BSD_SOURCE)
<Begasus> this coulld work alsoo :)
<jmairboeck> for CMake, but VBox uses kbuild
<jmairboeck> no idea how that works
<Begasus> I meant cmake yes :)
<Begasus> did some builds for VBox years ago
<Begasus> can't remember :)
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<Begasus> better :)
<OscarL> Begasus: work-7.0.20/sources/VirtualBox-7.0.20"... 1.65 GiB :-(
<Begasus> k clean build
<Begasus> eeps OscarL
<OscarL> just 103467 files (so far).
<Begasus> maybe you'd be better to check geos (or what was it)? :P
<OscarL> gsoap at 35 MiB tarball... vs 165 MiB tarball for VBox :-)
<Begasus> that one then ;)
<Begasus> k, linking with bsd went fine
<Begasus> let's see if it uses _GNU_SOURCE ... also
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<Begasus> plop
<Begasus> argh :(
<OscarL> somehow the struct dirent / d_name issue "fixed" itself :-) (or it might re-appear at a later date).
<Begasus> d_name/DT_DIR ... anyoing errors
<Begasus> 2 more down on PulkoMandy's list ;)
<OscarL> in defence of my "#define _DEFAULT_SOURCE" hack... previous patch already did "#define _BSD_SOURCE" :-D
<PulkoMandy> thanks for your help :)
<Begasus> first in line now try to fix this cmake build without gui before proceeding
<Begasus> np :)
<Begasus> think as most of us here tried to tackle those that matter the most to me :)
<Begasus> k, that didn't work also, keeping with first sollution that worked
<Begasus> aren't those "linked" to the correct paths?
<Begasus> k, launched build on 32bit also for cmake
<OscarL> for binary paths... maybe. But '#define _PATH_MAN "/usr/share/man"' *does* sounds pretty wrong.
<Begasus> bugger, madmax also has draft PR for cmake (without dropping gui)
<OscarL> "/usr/share/locale", heh, had to force that one out for csound.
<Begasus> :)
<Begasus> lol https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/pull/10986 (he also mentions the error) :)
<OscarL> yeah, that was why I mentioned it early (but was too lazy to link it :-D).
<Begasus> just commented there
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<Begasus> with all the non prior PR's atm lost it on the way :)
<Begasus> k, importing patch changes from madmax ...
<Begasus> hp -c ...
<Begasus> how big is this webkit_gtk thing?
<OscarL> no clue (and hope to never find out on my own).
<OscarL> how long will this darn vbox-ga build will take?
<OscarL> I miss those [x of y] progress from some other build systems :-)
<Begasus> nuked build on 32bit, rebuild with madmax patch
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<Begasus> checking cmake with konqueror :)
<Begasus> or konqueror with cmake? :P
<OscarL> darn, OSS was enabled on the main Config.kmk ... here we go again.
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<Begasus> heh
<Begasus> Hi nephele
<Nephele> hi there
<Nephele> qmplay2 works fine .9
<Nephele> :)
<Begasus> nice!
<Begasus> uninstalled it already here :P
<Begasus> nephele, do you have a 32bit install where you could check something that uses qtwebengine?
<Nephele> no
<Nephele> atleast, not at this time
<Begasus> looks like it's broken on 32bit, gives error in syslog for falkon and nexcloud (2 that I mostly use)
<OscarL> nephele: hi... earlier you wrote: "though currently if you unmount both filesystems on my flash drive it dissapears from the device tree and i dunno why"
<OscarL> maybe due to "Eject when unmounting" setting from Tracker preferences?
<Nephele> OscarL: maybe? but why would that affect thumb drives?
<OscarL> guess it affects all "removable" devices?
<Nephele> But I do have it set, I guess I will uncheck it. I was having this checked since I assumed the dvd would eject on unmount
<Nephele> and it does too :)
<Nephele> but for thumb drives this makes no sense as they can't be ejected as such
<OscarL> sounds like it needs a ticket then :-P
<Nephele> that just means you can't remount them without having to manually unplug them or reboot the computer :/
<OscarL> yeah, that's why I keep it unchecked too.
<Begasus> at least I got another browser in backup :) https://0x0.st/Xvj-.png
<OscarL> (but then I need to remember to /bin/eject them)
<OscarL> Begasus: one more for the KitsunePrefecture's collection :-)
<Begasus> heh, not releasing that one, keeping it all for myself :P
<OscarL> khtml was the sh*t! way back then (even if konqueror was way too heavy for my always too slow hardware)
<Begasus> not looking forward on bug reports on that one :P
<OscarL> heh
<Nephele> OscarL: why eject flash drives if they are unmounted?
<OscarL> because I'm usually doing passthrough to the VM, and that's a way to make them available to the host.
<Nephele> ah okay. That seems like an edge case, but makes sense
<OscarL> Finally!
<OscarL> I got to the same error state I was in Nov 2022 :-D
<Begasus> LOL
<Begasus> progress!!(?) :P
<OscarL> "declaration of xxxx has different exception specifier"
<Begasus> 2 to go then you get zzz has ...
<OscarL> Begasus: at least the version number is bigger this time! :-P
<Begasus> ok, granted, progress :D
<OscarL> Mmm, I have some dubious notes from past me: "Fixed" by adding RT_NO_THROW_PROTO to those 2 function in [...]/alloc-r0drv.cpp
<OscarL> not sure if I should trust "old me"... or if I was just trying to troll future me.
<Begasus> heh
<Begasus> biab
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<Begasus_32> make: INTERNAL: Exiting with 6 jobserver tokens available; should be 16!
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<Begasus> $jobArgs related?
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<OscarL> now the darn thing is compiling na embedded copy of openssl-3.1.5 :-D
<OscarL> s/na/an/
<Begasus> tsss ...
<Begasus> :)
<OscarL> and that's while using VBOX_ONLY_ADDITIONS, go figure.
<Begasus> can't comment without checking what it does :)
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<OscarL> The tarball includes the whole VirtualBox code, the guest-additions (specially for Haiku) are just a tiny fraction of all that...
<OscarL> but I guess it needs to link to other parts of the "VBox runtime", and to openssl for something :-)
<OscarL> "Linking VBoxGuest".... lots of "undefined reference to" :-)
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<OscarL> "put_module", "notify_select_event"... sounds "kernely"
<Begasus> eeps
<Begasus> guess the last time I looked at it was with linuxuser :P
<OscarL> makes sense (for some parts), as this builds some drivers/modules, but I get lost in the build process details.
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<OscarL> work dir 2.03 GiB... :-/
<OscarL> 108492 files.
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<OscarL> even git status goes in slow motion with so many files: "Refresh index: 75% (39474/52364)"
* OscarL extracts the current patchset, and calls it a day.
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<Begasus> nice, build finished on 32bit :D
<Begasus> let's try this konqoeror thing on 32bit :P
<Begasus> oh no kdesu on KF5 :P
<Anarchos> Begasus i have troubles with git on 32bits
<Begasus> Anarchos, I don't (so far)?
<OscarL> regarding those "path.h" I mentioned earlier... some got fixed in the past (https://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/headers/compatibility/bsd/paths.h?id=ae65896a9f477460611bcc1f14da1fad66bdd9d1) at least.
<Begasus> "now" I have kdesu on 32bit also for KF5 :)
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<Begasus> konqueror same issue with qtwebengine
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<Begasus> PulkoMandy, is there a way to use cmd:autoconf >= 2.69 for postgresql? can't seem to trigger it :/
<Begasus> v11*
<PulkoMandy> I don't know; I think the autoconf269 package doesn't provide a command named just autoconf?
<Begasus> no it doesn't
<Begasus> I see in the issue postgresql12 also needs it
<PulkoMandy> maybe we can create a symlink autoconf->autoconf269 in the postgresql build if there is no other way, or maybe we can create a package autoconf269_autoconf wiht just a symlink from "bin/autoconf" to "bin/autoconf269". But the simpler way is if postgresql buildsystem has a way to force what autoconf binary to use
<Begasus> checking repology ... maybe there is something there
<Begasus> whoot, lacking behind there :D
<Begasus> missing libdap_r in latest openldap
<Begasus> and in the older openldap the devel packages are nuked
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<hsp> Begasus, you mean rm -r /system/packages/*
<OscarL> do *NOT* do that.
<Begasus> jikes no!!!
<Begasus> maybe better use the tool to clean up some administrative states
<Begasus> k, got postgresql building to end up with undefined errors :/
<hsp> OscarL, which tool?
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<OscarL> FilWip
<hsp> ok
<Nephele> you can do that, but only once ;) your OS won't boot afterwards since you'll have deleted all system packages
<Begasus> don't think it will go down without a warning nephele :)
* OscarL signs off, wishining everyone a nice day.
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<Begasus> cu ...
<Begasus> grabbing postgresql11-11.1-5-x86_64.hpkg and moving it to /Opslag/haikuports/packages/postgresql11-11.1-5-x86_64.hpkg ...
<Begasus> maybe not the best atm, but it build (openssl3 and icu74)
<Begasus> PulkoMandy, disabled autoconf and added -lnetwork with LDFLAGS in BUILD() and option --disable-thread-safety
<Begasus> also re-enabled devel package for older openldap*
<PulkoMandy> well, if it works that way, there is no need to run autoconf
<Begasus> guess those could be dropped on an uptodate postgresql, for now it should be good enough
<PulkoMandy> we had to do this back when most configure scripts didn't know about haiku, but now they do
<Begasus> yeah been there :)
<Begasus> checking v12
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<Begasus> nice :) grabbing postgresql12-12.0-5-x86_64.hpkg and moving it to /Opslag/haikuports/packages/postgresql12-12.0-5-x86_64.hpkg
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<Begasus> Warning: POLICY WARNING: "/packaging/postgresql12_server/bin/postgres" needs library "libldap-2.4.so.2", but the package doesn't seem to declare that as a requirement
<Begasus> probably could switch that definition to make it use the proper devel package also
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<Begasus> nicey!! lib:libldap_2.4 >= 2.10.11 :D
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/e483bd102c6d...3413c479acdf
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus 3413c47 - openldap2.4, revbump, re-enable devel (needed for postgresql) (#10989)
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<Begasus> k, let's see what we still need for postgresql
<Begasus> jmairboeck, if you read this, changes to openldap/postresql* is only done to have "current" verrsions still around, no hastle further allong the line :)
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<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±2] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/3413c479acdf...2235bdbd939f
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus 2235bdb - postgresql, revbump version for openssl3 (#10990)
<Begasus> k, let's see how this goes on buildmasters :)
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<Begasus> Hi jmairboeck :)
<Begasus> bugger, build error on 32bit ...
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<jmairboeck> Hi Begasus
<jmairboeck> that remark on the postgres PR was just meant as a general style suggestion, but no big deal
<Begasus> np :) maybe good it's added in case someone gets ideas :)
<Nephele> hmm, scummvm runs
<Nephele> i wonder if i can install blade runner now
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<Nephele> ugh, logged into gog to download it and get "unrecognized or bad transfer encoding"
<Nephele> not sure what that means
* Begasus hides
<Begasus> I don't do gog nephele, so haven't been able to check that out
<Nephele> Why do you need to hide for that? :(
<Begasus> because I'm maintaining scummvm for a while ;)
<Nephele> Well, I don't see how you maintaining much would lead to you having to get all complaints ;)
<Begasus> true that :)
<Begasus> can't cover all :D
<Begasus> meantime postgresql11 finished on 32bit here :D
<Begasus> jmairboeck, for this also, I'm just doing quick fixes to have them packaged, no more :D
<Nephele> I had already installed blade runner somewhere else
<Nephele> too bad gog.com doesn't work
<Begasus> maybe you could grab some info, could have a look (after things settle down) :P
<Nephele> Why? you want to track down webkit issues? :D
<Begasus> errr no! :D
<Nephele> well this is an issue with curl not loading gog.com in webkit ;)
<Nephele> I guess I will pick the installer form another system or so
<Begasus> good to know :D
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [+1/-1/±0] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/2235bdbd939f...07f836a89c49
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] kenmays 07f836a - bash: bump version (#10849)
<Begasus> whohoo!!! cya icu66!! :P
<waddlesplash> jmairboeck: git crashes on 32-bit trying to clone haikuwebkit
<waddlesplash> PulkoMandy noted this yesterday, I can reproduce also
<waddlesplash> git clone https://github.com/haiku/haikuwebkit --depth=10
<waddlesplash> crashes at 25% and 50MB downloaded
<waddlesplash> the crash specifically is in inflate()
<waddlesplash> let's try upgrading/rebuilding zlib...
<Anarchos> waddlesplash i was to the point to signal the git crash (in inflating) :)
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<waddlesplash> PulkoMandy: upgrading zlib and it's gotten past the crash point
<waddlesplash> so, maybe just another unwind problem on 32-bit GCC13
<PulkoMandy> Unwind? In C code?
<waddlesplash> or a bug fixed in 1.3.1
<waddlesplash> well, the bash backtrace appears to be related to unwinding the stack?
<waddlesplash> I don't know what's going on there but at least that's what the function names look like
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<waddlesplash> PulkoMandy: nope, crashed again. this time at 88% and 843MB however
<waddlesplash> so, it got much further this try
<waddlesplash> this time it's in sha1_compression_states
<jmairboeck> I also tried it now and got a crash of git somewhere sha1 related
<waddlesplash> it's a NULL dereference
<waddlesplash> the source file in git hasn't been changed substantially in years
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [+2/-2/±0] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/07f836a89c49...1f1ab7c7d53c
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] waddlesplash 1f1ab7c - zlib: Bump to 1.3.1.
<waddlesplash> jmairboeck: oh, I actually get a disassembly
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±2] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/1f1ab7c7d53c...a3ae526a753a
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus a3ae526 - postgresql, fixes for 32bit (#10991)
<waddlesplash> jmairboeck: http://0x0.st/Xv_J.report
<Begasus> crossing fingers ...
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev58034] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=d8df56379c74+%5E729906049aa6
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] d8df56379c74 - DHCPClient: Fix use of uninitialized timing values.
* Anarchos began the accelerometer driver for his laptop
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<waddlesplash> I wonder if the bash crashes are in any way related
<jmairboeck> I got some of those too, also with no disassembly, at least in the report I saved.
<waddlesplash> so ... the debug allocator seems to reproduce this 100% of the time
<waddlesplash> the bash crashes that is
<jmairboeck> mostly during haikuporter updating dependency info
<Begasus> getting some weird errors on 32bit also when building
<waddlesplash> NULL dereference in the debug allocator in atomic_test_and_set 100% of the time
<Begasus> but haven't updated there yet
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuporter] kallisti5 pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-1/±1] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuporter/compare/775be2014ce3...651fe617b5b5
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuporter] kallisti5 651fe61 - buildmaster/backend: Document storage backend config file
<Begasus> updating ...
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<Anarchos> so i have to wait tomorrow to get the zlib corrected ?
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<Begasus> dropdown menu in Find OK now :)
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<Skipp_OSX> nice :)
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<Begasus> the master in tha house! :)
<phschafft> hm...
<mmlr> forgot all the irc stuff
<Begasus> beside you phschafft :)
<Begasus> I meant the "buildmaster" :)
<Begasus> bias
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<Begasus> kallisti5[m], any idea how this could be fixed/defined?
<phschafft> Begasus: ah, I was wondering about the status of nephele.
<Begasus> status?
<Begasus> nephele, got any status? ;)
<Nephele> Lag: 0.043
<Begasus> 0.061
<kallisti5[m]> Begasus: I didn't look much into it. I can take a crack at it... but my backlog is pretty long at the moment
<Begasus> np kallisti5[m], maybe cmake PR can be merged and looked into later then (for this)
<Begasus> no idea how to pass an arch in that file
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<phschafft> Begasus: him being a master vs. not.
<Begasus> no question about that here phschafft :)
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<waddlesplash> oh hey, it's mmlr!
<waddlesplash> been a while since you were on IRC
<mmlr> I'm trying to crash stuff with system wide guarded heap and happened to open Vision
<mmlr> not many crashes however, seems pretty stable on x86_64
<waddlesplash> yes, guarded heap seems relatively stable there
<PulkoMandy> I have no problems on my x86_64 machine here, but the 32bit one is behaving quite badly
<waddlesplash> yes, same here
<waddlesplash> mmlr: how are you forcing guarded heap? LD_PRELOAD+MALLOC_DEBUG? Why not just change default libroot to load guarded heap by default?
<mmlr> same with the x86_gcc2 builder VM I used to test recently
<waddlesplash> I can reproduce the crashes 100% at least now
<waddlesplash> so, let's build a debug libroot and see what we get
<mmlr> I patch src/system/kernel/main.cpp to use load_image of launch_daemon with an env of LD_PRELOAD=libroot_debug.so and MALLOC_DEBUG=grs25a1
<waddlesplash> haikuporter and other things reset those envs
<waddlesplash> or start with a totally fresh env
<mmlr> yes, haikuporter may
<waddlesplash> you may want to change the default libroot to use those settings by default
<waddlesplash> not may, it definitely does, I tested
<waddlesplash> ... libroot built with -g -Og doesn't crash
<waddlesplash> great. let's see about -g without -O change
<mmlr> so either timing sensitive and a race condition or an optimization with unsafe code?
<waddlesplash> oh wait, I configured the non-packaged lib
<waddlesplash> incorrectly
<waddlesplash> mmlr: or, memory overrun into static buffer that gets placed differently with -g
<waddlesplash> that's what I'm guessing at the moment based on symptoms
<mmlr> yeah
<mmlr> bash was what crashed most for me
<waddlesplash> ok, placed it correctly this time, no crash still
<mmlr> also on the "outside" of building, just booting Haiku itself
<waddlesplash> this is all 32bit?
<mmlr> yes
<waddlesplash> ok
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<Begasus> PulkoMandy libgit2 builds ok with a small change here
<waddlesplash> the only recent 32-bit only change I can think of is https://github.com/haiku/haiku/commit/9921f444625e360674f92db84ffae695492233a5
<mmlr> I tested HaikuPorter with S3 backend and wanted to validate secondary arch so I set up a x86_gcc2 hybrid
<mmlr> right off the bat it booted into a white screen with a bash crash
<waddlesplash> hm
<waddlesplash> actually all the crashes I can see here it's EDX that's 0x0
<waddlesplash> so. maybe I got that wrong somehow?
<waddlesplash> or maybe it's unrelated
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<waddlesplash> seems weird it would be intermittent though, if that's the culprit
<waddlesplash> and weird that we wouldn't notice for the past 2 weeks
<mmlr> the production x86_gcc2 builder in the cloud is fine, also no random crashes during builds, so it seems recent
<waddlesplash> EDX should be caller-saved
<waddlesplash> and syscalls are function calls, so, it shouldn't be a problem that it gets clobbered?
<mmlr> why does that commit change anything for strace? the TRACE_POST_SYSCALL macro hat the edx clearing in there already, no?
<waddlesplash> strace doesn't work through trace post syscall
<waddlesplash> it works through post_syscall_work
<mmlr> ah
<waddlesplash> and we clear the 64BIT_RETURN before calling the debugger (if we call the debugger at all)
<waddlesplash> so we can't just check this in the debugger itself
<waddlesplash> I guess it's possible that EDX is only caller-saved when the caller has a 64bit return value?
<PulkoMandy> waddlesplash: I think the change in that commit is not just changing the register value, but replacing it in the stackframe (where maybe a register value was saved during the call)
<waddlesplash> PulkoMandy: hmm. maybe so
<PulkoMandy> But I don't know enough 32bit x86 to be sure how this all works...
<waddlesplash> I guess this isn't a safe change after all. let's rework it to not do that then
<mmlr> I mean if you can easily reproduce it, backing out the change and checking would be easy
<waddlesplash> I can, but it's annoyingly intermittent
<waddlesplash> but EDX does seem to basically always be involved
<waddlesplash> so I don't know what else it could be
<PulkoMandy> and I'm not setup for cross-development so I don't know if I can manage to build a test image. But I can try
<waddlesplash> I am set up, I'll test it
<Begasus> closing down
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<Begasus> cu peeps!
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<mmlr> just had one of those boot hangs again on x86_64 where it just sits at the boot screen with everything lit
<waddlesplash> did you check KDL?
<waddlesplash> I've been getting those more often and it's usually https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/18991
<waddlesplash> (this is not a problem on beta branch however)
<waddlesplash> (because on beta branch the network module isn't unloaded)
<PulkoMandy> I'm trying to understand what the initial hroblem in strace was. As far as I can see, the return type of syscalls is known (from gensyscall data), why would strace try to print 32 bit values as 64 bit then?
<waddlesplash> strace just prints whatever the debugger gave us
<waddlesplash> if there's a 64-bit value, it prints that
<mmlr> waddlesplash: I did not check enough threads to know, but the timing and what was running at that time would fit
<waddlesplash> we could maybe fix this on the strace side but it seems bad to leak random kernel values
<waddlesplash> what would be ideal would be for the debugger to know if we had a 64 bit syscall value
<waddlesplash> but we clear the flag by then
<waddlesplash> and we have to use an atomic loop to do it, so, it's not easy to move that
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<waddlesplash> the basic patch to not clobber EDX is easy enough
<waddlesplash> but fixing the original bug again is tough
<PulkoMandy> strace knows about the type from gensyscalls data, and uses that in a variety of ways already (to decode status_t into errors for example), so it could use that to know the size of the return value as well
<PulkoMandy> Anyway, I think the asm code can be changed so that the jnz skips over the modification of edx in the iframe, instead of setting edx to 0 and then overwriting the iframe with that
<waddlesplash> yes
<waddlesplash> I made that edit, but I wanted to fix the other half before rebooting to test
<waddlesplash> maybe we can just move the THREAD_FLAGS_DEBUGGER_INSTALLED check
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<PulkoMandy> I'd rather fix it in strace and not add extra code in the syscall handler, if possible. We don't really want to make it slower
<waddlesplash> we need to not leak kernel memory here no matter what
<waddlesplash> so we need to have the testl and then avoid setting EDX if we can
<waddlesplash> but the extra code for the DEBUGGER_INSTALLED case doesn't matter because it won't be executed if the flag is unset
<waddlesplash> that case will already be much slower, it won't make much difference
<waddlesplash> mmlr: btw, if you create areas with PROT_NONE now, they won't reserve any memory
<waddlesplash> they'll reserve it on demand when you mprotect
<waddlesplash> for your guarded heap changes
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<mmlr> it already uses B_OVERCOMMITTING_AREA
<jhj> Would it be OK to open a ticket to add MADV_DONTDUMP and MADV_DODUMP to madvise?
<jhj> These are supported decently widely elsewhere.
<waddlesplash> how widely?
<waddlesplash> core files on Haiku are a bit different than elsewhere
<waddlesplash> mmlr: ah
<jhj> Linux, AIX, FrseBSD, and current Solaris.
<waddlesplash> right now most of our MADV do nothing
<waddlesplash> I think MADV_FREE may be the only one that does anything
<jhj> It's MADV_NOCORE and DOCORE on FreeBSD.
<jhj> It's super useful to exclude hundreds of megs of stuff (virtual machine memory) from emulators for example.
<waddlesplash> I don't know how useful this would be on Haiku because most of the time we just generate text reports
<waddlesplash> if you really want a core file why wouldn't you want everything?
<jhj> waddlesplash: A virtual machine that has 8GB of memory assigned for example.
<waddlesplash> okay but if most of that's zeroes, what's the problem
<waddlesplash> and under what scenarios would you want a full core file but not that memory?
<PulkoMandy> Why not? Anyway, opening a ticket sounds good. Not sure if anyone will get to it soon
<jhj> LLVM uses it in a few places.
<jhj> Some of those automatic crash reporters user it to try to avoid egregiously sending user data.
<waddlesplash> automatic crash reporters should use the text report format on Haiku
<jhj> I'll open a ticket later, it's nothing that's urgent.
<waddlesplash> doesn't send any user data (well, besides what's in stack frame memory and registers)
<waddlesplash> this is the patch I'm going to test
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<mmlr> waddlesplash: but that always clears edx regardless of the 64 bit flag as the xor is before the test?
<waddlesplash> mmlr: in post_syscall_work() yes
<waddlesplash> we either want it to be 0 or the value from the syscall
<waddlesplash> this is after we've stored it inside the iframe field, that's not affected
<waddlesplash> well, the patch boots anyway
<mmlr> I read it as it being stored into the iframe at line 60 but cleared at line 57
<waddlesplash> unless I'm mistaken, line 60 is reading it, not storing it
<waddlesplash> lines 28 and 30 store it
<waddlesplash> this is GNU assembler syntax, I think
<mmlr> yeah, that's what confused me
<waddlesplash> anyway considering how rare the crashes were, I wonder if this code was actually broken before, but it wasn't noticed because EDX didn't get properly clobbered very often
<waddlesplash> anyway with the patch, strace still works and a full rebuild of the haikuports repository directory did not crash at all when run with libroot_debug (not guarded heap)
<waddlesplash> previously it crashed at least 3-4 times (regular malloc) or almost every single recipe (libroot debug)
<mmlr> so the difference to before is that we leave edx in the iframe alone if it's not a 64 bit syscall instead of resetting it to 0?
<waddlesplash> so, I guess that fixes it
<waddlesplash> mmlr: yes
<waddlesplash> and before my previous change, we clobbered it with whatever we had locally for EDX
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<waddlesplash> which maybe was always correct if we loaded EDX from the iframe?
<waddlesplash> at the beginning that is, and then nothing later on clobbered it without restoring it
<mmlr> maybe
<mmlr> if that wasn't the case, it should have crashed as well at least sometimes
<waddlesplash> yes
<waddlesplash> but less often
<waddlesplash> I wonder if there are any random crashes on x86 that this will clear up
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<waddlesplash> and git checkout of haikuwebkit appears to have worked, it's gotten up to the "updating files stage" which it never did before
<waddlesplash> so, that's it apparently
<waddlesplash> change posted: https://review.haiku-os.org/c/haiku/+/8158
<waddlesplash> mmlr: ^
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev58035] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=07cfddfa0c7e+%5Ed8df56379c74
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 07cfddfa0c7e - kernel/x86: Rework handling of %edx in syscall handler (again.)
<mmlr> I've given it a +2
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<waddlesplash> nephele: heh, that post about the clock on social media yesterday has done better than most Haiku posts in recent memory :P
<waddlesplash> should CC the promotions group about that...
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<waddlesplash> (it's in #haiku-promo fwiw)
<TypiCal> Hi Guys!
<TypiCal> made a small username change xD
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<PulkoMandy> Keeping the Haiku tradition of using nicknames, I see :)
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<TypiCal> :)
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<erysdren> hi haiku people
<erysdren> i'm looking at the Jam build system, cuz i'm suck of make and cmake for my personal projects
<erysdren> what advantages does the Haiku fork of Jam have over other versions, like ftjam and k8jam? (and the original perforce version)
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<marzzbar> erysdren: This might be helpful for you https://www.freelists.org/post/haiku/New-Build-System
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<Nephele> waddlesplash: I would expect it to, the normal stuff is mostly just boosts of random haiku related stuff :)
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