<nekobot>
[haiku/haiku] 14744074dde8 - Revert "unistd.h: Add cast to (void*) for first argument in C mode."
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<nephele_xmpp>
waddlesplash: around?
<waddlesplash>
yes
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<nephele_xmpp>
waddlesplash: around?
<waddlesplash>
yes
<nephele_xmpp>
Sorry, got send twice. Anyway, can you delete the spamming user in trac? It just re-makes a post when I delete it. Don't think i can delete the user
<nephele_xmpp>
I did delete the spam monitoring entry as spam. I assumed this would delete the post, and not the entry...
<Begasus[m]>
mostly useful when using debug packages
<Begasus[m]>
Hi OscarL :)
<OscarL>
Morning Begasus[m] :-)
<Begasus[m]>
doggies first :)
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<Begasus[m]>
k, fresh coffee to go with it
* Begasus[m]
hands a fresh cup to those wanting one
<Anarchos>
Begasus[m]: i take one :)
* Begasus[m]
hands Anarchos one fresh cup of home made coffee
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<Begasus>
script to bump the rc's for KF6 needs more fintuning
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<Anarchos>
Begasus: i finally pushed a patch for netboot 32 bits :)
<Begasus>
nice Anarchos! one down :)
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<Begasus>
new library in ki18n :)
<Anarchos>
Begasus: but i am still wiating for a review by korli on my betex patch ...
<Begasus>
haven't checked up there anymore
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<Anarchos>
can't wait to be tonight to begin work on pxe boot 64 bits :)
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<Begasus>
;)
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<OscarL>
Wanted to see if I could start working on updating some python packages... the mess of depedencies and explosion of things to check... kinda killed any motivation I had :-(
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* Begasus
hands some comfort mood coffee to OscarL
<Begasus>
you were too quiet :)
<OscarL>
was chasing dependencies, and getting more and more bummed down the longer it went :-(
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<OscarL>
Let's see if I can at least do some cleanup.
<Begasus>
biab
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<Anarchos>
Begasus: do you know where $TARGET_ARCH is defined ?
<Begasus>
not me Anarchos, that's Haiku's internals :)
<OscarL>
Anarchos: can't find where TARGET_ARCH is set (not under build*/, generated*/*, or even on jam's source code :-/)
<OscarL>
ArchitectureRules says: "[...] TARGET_ARCH are set to the values for the respective packaging architecture", but I only see it used as "for var in TARGET_ARCH" there.
<nephele_xmpp>
hi
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<Begasus[m]>
hi nephele_xmpp
<OscarL>
good day nephele_xmpp.
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<Begasus[m]>
haikuporter -S -v ... anyone know what -v does here? (maybe verbose?)
<Begasus>
nvm :)
<Begasus>
-E foo (excludes foo being added to the test for cmake) :)
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<Begasus>
network issues today OscarL?
<OscarL>
Seems so.
<OscarL>
Sigh... my little "lets do some little clean up then" turned into this: https://bpa.st/TZK76
<Begasus>
well for sphinx I wouldn't mind dropping python3.9
<Begasus>
It probably should just support the default one
<Begasus>
if numpy still builds ok for python3.10, just cleanup and drop 3.9?
<OscarL>
that's the idea, but cannot do so while other recipes still use it.
<Begasus>
what's up with assimp?
<Begasus>
it requires sphinx for the documentation but not revers?
<Begasus>
OscarL, planning to remove cython all together?
<OscarL>
I was tryinbg to figure out what needed "sphinx_rtd_theme". assimo_docs came out... IMO, it doesn't makes much sense to have that on-tree,
<Begasus>
as in .. it shouldn't be mentioned in the assimp recipe?
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<Begasus>
sorry, busy with that rc for kf6, can't check too much :)
<OscarL>
ir assimp_docs gives nothing.
<Begasus>
/Share/haikuports/media-libs/assimp/assimp_docs-5.3.0.recipe:2:DESCRIPTION="This is the documentation for the Open Asset Import Library (short name: Assimp)."
<Begasus>
ps, don't brake sphinx, also need it for ECM :)
<OscarL>
my point is... I don't think it makes sense to have the docs for that library.
<OscarL>
only used by qt5
<Begasus>
having docs or not is a separate issue :)
<OscarL>
yes, but it adds to the workload for not much benefit in this case.
<Begasus>
might as well skipp docs overall then? I'm not seeing the problem
<Begasus>
you want to nuke that specifix python package?
<OscarL>
In the same way that I think we should not package every python thing under the sun... I don't think we shoul add docs for every single library. Specially pretty obsure ones.
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<OscarL>
if the docs were at least "pre-made", and we just needed to package them... fine.
<OscarL>
but havign to add stuff just to generate the docs? I think it way overkill, unless it is something Haiku users/devs actually need.
<OscarL>
Begasus: what's that ECM you mentioned earlier?
<Begasus>
can't stop you from removing them all, I just think that sphinx is a pretty nice tool for this, and even other packages require extra build steps to create/include the documentation
<Begasus>
ECM as in extra-cmake-modules
<Begasus>
is it needed? no, could be handy? who knows ... make it obsolete? ...
<OscarL>
I'm not trying to remove sphinx.
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<Begasus>
well, if I understand it right, one or more of it's sub-packages/requirements?
<OscarL>
notice that my paste just was /me wondering why the hell we had that _doc package.
<OscarL>
I had to check it out, because it uses sphinx stuff.
<OscarL>
notice that my plan for the rest of sphinx stuff is just remove the 3.9.
<Begasus>
no argue from me there :)
<OscarL>
I just get annoyed by the endless string of dependencies / relations / possible breakages, etc.
<OscarL>
for more "important" stuff, it gets easier to justify, that's all.
<Begasus>
we're long past that stage of easy dependencies I guess, have been there numurous times
<Begasus>
but yeah, python is something specific
<Begasus>
and maybe we should just stop adding python versions (eg multiple) in recipes and only go for one default
<OscarL>
yes.
<Begasus>
that one for websockets I got here, doesn't even have a python suffix
<OscarL>
even with only one version, there's stuff we can't even package decently because different package need different verisons of the same package :-D
<Begasus>
well, numpy being a deal-breaker in there, stuff that relies on it can't get past that version for a while
<Begasus>
what the stats on the EOL for python3.10?
<OscarL>
example: newer contourpy needs pybind11 >= 2.13.1, but != 2.13.3.... but cannot update to that version, because new scipy wants: pybynd11 >= 2.12.0, but < 2.13.0 :-D
<Begasus[m]>
Moving to godot will kill it for Haiku anyway then
<OscarL>
can't save them all.
<OscarL>
(says the guy that spent far too long on "noteshrink" :-D)
<Begasus[m]>
heh
<OscarL>
re newer python... yeah... by next yeah, hope the ecosystem has stabilized enough around Python 3.13, if not.. 3.12 should be at least a more stable target.
<Begasus[m]>
way too much distraction today :/
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<Begasus[m]>
iirc in Linux terms, the even number was considered stabe :)
<Begasus[m]>
atleast way back * :)
<OscarL>
Begasus[m]: welp... then we're screwed till Python 4 :-P
<Begasus>
lol
<Begasus>
that was for the MINOR version :P
<Anarchos>
Begasus: i think i won't need to do a haiku_loader.pxe_x64.... just compile the baiku_netboot.tgz with TARGET_ARCH=x86_64 should be enough to boot a haiku 64 bits image. Will test that tonight.
<Begasus>
+1
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<Anarchos>
Begasus: that's why i look for where is defined TARGET_ARCH . I know it comes from the 'configure --target-arch x86_64' option
<Begasus[m]>
at least you found it?
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<OscarL>
"Error: No version of pyzmq can be built". Would be nice if haikuporter offered to build the "_x86" version in that situation. Same with pkgman. :-)
<Begasus>
patches welcome? :)
<Begasus>
what if a package is available for both?
<OscarL>
then it wouldn't give that error.
<Begasus>
yeah, but you might want to use the _x86 :)
<OscarL>
why Beezer is not in $PATH? :-(
<OscarL>
Because it is under "[...]/apps/Beezer/Beezer" I guess.
<OscarL>
15.69 MiB? Ouch.
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<OscarL>
847.94 KiB after "strip Beezer" 8-|
<OscarL>
4.13 MiB for the 64 bits version.
<Begasus[m]>
not much stripping there?
<OscarL>
4.13 on 64 bits, 15.69 on 32 bits are what the .hpkg contain. Haven't tried striping the 64 bits.
<OscarL>
32 bits is built with gcc2... so I guess that the debug info format is really inefficient there.
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<MonniTheCat>
<Anarchos> "Begasus: that's why i look for..." <- I think build/jam/ArchitectureRules
<matthewcroughan>
If this is the main channel, are there others?
<matthewcroughan>
And is there a Haiku matrix space that I accidentally didn't join?
<zard>
There are other channels such as #haiku-offtopic, but they rarely have people on them
<MonniTheCat>
There is matrix space...
<zard>
Or rather, they rarely have conversations in them
<zard>
I know there's a Matrix bridge to this IRC chat
<zard>
(and an XMPP bridge)
<MonniTheCat>
If people are not talking, we can safely assume they are either in KDL or waiting for Haiku to reboot...
<Anarchos>
matthewcroughan: there is also a #haiku-fr for french speaker
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<Begasus>
also #haiku-nl (not very active) :)
<Begasus>
mostly me myself and Habbie :D
<Anarchos>
MonniTheCat: in ArchitectureRules, i can find 'use' of TARGET_ARCH, but not its defintiion
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<MonniTheCat>
Anarchos: For me, it was around lines 880 to 883
<OscarL>
Simplified some code, got more accurate output. Nice when that happens.
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<MonniTheCat>
Anarchos: HAIKU_ARCH is set on line 73 of ArchitectureRules if it isn't already set...
<Anarchos>
MonniTheCat: yes. Now i wonder if i must do "configure --target x86_64;jam...." or just "TARGET_ARCH=x86_64 jam ..." to skip the configure part
<Anarchos>
btw, i just need to "jam haiku-netboot-archive"
<MonniTheCat>
I don't think it's possible to skip the configure part, as it creates generated/build/BuildConfig, which is referenced by other files jam use...
<Anarchos>
ok will try tonight to see if i can build a 64bit haiku_netboot.tgz, able to launch a 64bits haiku image
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<matthewcroughan>
Can someone give me the haiku matrix space url that I apply to the /join cmd so I can join it?
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<OscarL>
matthewcroughan: from this channel's Topic: "Matrix: #haiku:matrix.org".
<OscarL>
(never used it myself)
<Begasus[m]>
#haiku:matrix.org should do it I guess
<Begasus[m]>
or maybe search for "Haiku - Main"?
<Begasus[m]>
it shows like that in NeoChat
<OscarL>
couldn't "import zmq", turns out I had installed just the (empty) base package :-P
<Begasus[m]>
lol
<Begasus[m]>
afk for a while
* phschafft
waves to nephele_xmpp.
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<dovsienko>
waddlesplash: the AArch64 faults on unaligned access you mention were a thing of 32-bit ARM, as far as I know
<waddlesplash>
dovsienko: ?
<dovsienko>
re the September activity report
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<waddlesplash>
the faults happen on arm64 for uncached areas
<waddlesplash>
they don't happen for regular areas
<dovsienko>
perhaps in kernel... in userspace I tried to get alignment-incorrect code cause a CPU fault (this SIGILL or SIGBUS), and this did not was even an option on 64 bits, and when enabled on 32 bits, it did not work
<dovsienko>
so the only way to test code for proper alignment is using Octeon or SPARC or possibly s390x
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<dovsienko>
excuse me for the typos, I am a bit tired
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<MonniTheCat>
ARM as architecture has instructions that intentionally cause alignment violation... I've seen only few toolchains use those instructions by default... otherwise it's pretty much handwritten assembly that can use those instructions...
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<dovsienko>
I could be tempted to help if I did not have other unfinished commitments
<Anarchos>
dovsienko the next-server ip is the address of the haiku server
<dovsienko>
Anarchos: it is simpler than I suspected
<Anarchos>
waddlesplash you mean i worked for nothing on making net boot works again ? oO
<waddlesplash>
Anarchos: no, no
<waddlesplash>
this would be a pretty radical refactor
<waddlesplash>
and I don't have any intention of working on it really
<waddlesplash>
it's just an aidea
<waddlesplash>
idea
<Anarchos>
waddlesplash btw, i don't know what to do with the comment of mika about calculating the netboot archive size and put it into tarfs.cpp
<waddlesplash>
going that route is probably a bad idea indeed
<Anarchos>
from what i understand, the kTarRegionSize in tarfs.cpp is just used in haiku_loader.pxe_ia32, so no infinite calculus in sight, right ?
<Anarchos>
(recursion i mean, not calculus)
<waddlesplash>
no, it's used for other things
<waddlesplash>
like regular CD boot iirc
<Anarchos>
i try to find use of tarfs but just found haiku_loader.pxe_XXX anyway i may be missing some references
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<Anarchos>
dovsienko interesting : i can serve specific boot files by ip in dhcpd.conf, so i can serve 32 bits or 64 bits haiku-net-boot-archive according to which computer is asking .
<Anarchos>
i wonder if i can launch 2 instances of remote_disk_server on different ports ?
<PulkoMandy>
waddlesplash: The netboot archive is only for pxe boot. The other architectures (openfirmware) are much simpler already
<waddlesplash>
ah
<PulkoMandy>
I used network boot that way for the sparc bringup, it just needs the kernel and the remote disk
<PulkoMandy>
the bootloader and the remote disk*
<PulkoMandy>
The bootloader uses openfirmware network support, so no drivers are needed. Then it boots as usual
<PulkoMandy>
I think efi could do the same if we implement efi networking?
<waddlesplash>
yeah, I think so
<waddlesplash>
does it use OpenFirmware UDP/ethernet support? how does that work with the boot loader net stack code?
<waddlesplash>
because right now the boot loader net stack is linked in always
<waddlesplash>
it's a static library so it probably just gets dropped most of the time
<waddlesplash>
probably we should drop it from the default link set
<PulkoMandy>
I think openfimware implements sending and receiving ethernet frames and then we build on top of that
<waddlesplash>
ah
<waddlesplash>
EFI actually supports up to UDP at least
<dovsienko>
Anarchos: there is a DHCP client option, which I do not remember exactly, but it sound like "Boot-Class", and its value tells the server what architecture it is and whether this is a BIOS or a UEFI boot. then the server can differentiate the answer based on that option. I've seen this work reliably
<waddlesplash>
so we could drop our implementation and just use the EFI firmware
<PulkoMandy>
Yes, it could be even simpler if that works
<PulkoMandy>
And also useful to allow the bootloader to send logs over udp for debugging
* Anarchos
is only on bios boot :(
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<Anarchos>
dovsienko ok, but i am not sure i can run two instances of remote_disk_server on same computer...
<dovsienko>
from there you can tell a 32-bit UEFI host from a 64-bit UEFI host, if that's the problem that needs to be solved
<Anarchos>
dovsienko i don't use uefi, just bios .
* Anarchos
finds that remote_disk_server uses hard-coded 8765 port. Not hard to transform it into a parameter, but how to correlate the port used by haiku-netboot-archive ?
<dovsienko>
perhaps pxeboot could generate one of those if you load it first
<PulkoMandy>
Why do you need to change it? Having it always one the same port is one less thing that can be wrong
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<dovsienko>
because the file name is not in the request/response space?
<Anarchos>
PulkoMandy to have 2 instances of it on same machine
<Anarchos>
to serve 32/64 bits images
<dovsienko>
a crude solution would be to run two VMs on different addresses, one for each file
<Anarchos>
waddlesplash congrats for the activity report !
<waddlesplash>
:)
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* Anarchos
upvotes for the return of the 'hqngmqn' command in kdl :)
<coolcoder613>
s/q/a
<Anarchos>
coolcoder613 joke intended : i have a french layout keyboard (azerty) but kdl knows only qwerty so i must type "hqng,qn"