ChanServ changed the topic of #haiku to: Open-source operating system that specifically targets personal computing. | | Nightlies: | Bugtracker: | SCM: | Logs: | Matrix: | XMPP:
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<cynic[m]> Hello.
<cynic[m]> Can I emulate other OS's on Haiku?
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<augiedoggie> qemu is available to run other operating systems in a virtual machine, but it's not accelerated so it's a bit slow
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<cynic[m]> is there any dark theme for the UI?
<augiedoggie> yes
<augiedoggie> i don't use it so i don't remember how to enable it :P
<cynic[m]> Thanks, augiedoggie.
<cynic[m]> The matrix room is broken apparently somehow. I read your comments on the irc logs.
<cynic[m]> I'll see how I can solve this before making more questions. Thank you again.
<scanty> good evening.
<IIsi> or you could try the HaikuThemeManager
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<bbjimmy> after about a day. my local ip changes to an ip out of the range for the router and I cannot fix it without a reboot.
<bbjimmy> I should have an ip or and gateway of When the network messes uo it sets me to with a gateway of ?? The network preferences crashes and then will not laynch again. rebooting fixes the problem. hrev57754 x86_64
<bbjimmy> *launch
<bbjimmy> using dhcp
<bbjimmy> anybody make recent changes to networking or dhcp lately?
<cynic[m]> is there a reliable secure firewall implemented?
<cynic[m]> Google and Microsoft are eating Linux alive. We need an alternative.
<bbjimmy> I know of no firewall implimented on haiku.
<bbjimmy> *
<cynic[m]> is there a way to get rid of all proprietary blobs? like Linux-Libre does with their kernel?
<bbjimmy> After browsing the source, I don't think we have any proprietory blobs in the kernel.
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<cynic[m]> <bbjimmy> ""; <- nice
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<cynic[m]> Apparently haiku uses gcc.
<cynic[m]> Can't it use musl?
<cynic[m]> Alpine Linux is super light and fast because of it.
<augiedoggie> large portions of the c library(libroot) use musl
<cynic[m]> what about app packages?
<augiedoggie> i don't understand the questio
<augiedoggie> n
<cynic[m]> in Alpine Linux, as far as I understand, all packages are compiled using musl
<cynic[m]> which makes it superfast
<augiedoggie> any app that uses the standard c library will use the musl functions that are in it
<cynic[m]> afaics it uses no musl for apps only gcc
<cynic[m]> After using Alpine I can see how much bloat gcc produces, so I'm trying to get rid of it as much as I can.
<coolcoder613> gcc != glibc
<cynic[m]> I'm sorry, , I meant glibc.
<cynic[m]> I guess the right question to ask would be: how does compare libroot to musl?
<augiedoggie> it's a mix of glibc and musl
<cynic[m]> Got it.
<cynic[m]> Thank you.
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<HaikuUser> I am person
<HaikuUser> Great
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<HaikuUser> What is usuallly used for Youtube and Rumble solutions (video streaming)?
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<Begasus> g'morning peeps
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<Calisto> Heyy
<Begasus> Hi Calisto
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<Calisto> Hey Begasus. How are you?
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<Calisto> by the way, is there someone who has worked with a PoseView's source code before? I was wanting to know whether there is an upper sort of a cap as to how many times you can call a refresh on a PoseView?
<Calisto> It seems to stop responding to Refresh's after a certain number of times... By any chance does this have something to do with threads and synchronisation?
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<HaikuUser2> Good morning/afternoon/evening everyone :)
<HaikuUser2> Pardon the default name, I'm fairly new to IRC
<HaikuUser> Haiku is very fun!
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<HaikuUser> I just installed Haiku today, it's very interesting! Hopefully it's treating everyone well :D
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<phschafft> :)
<Bones223> Hello :D
<Bones223> Finally got this to work lol >u<
<Begasus> Hi Bones223, glad you like it
<Bones223> Thank you :D Yeah, I'm super new so I appreciate your warm welcome!
<Begasus> 'lo phschafft, Calisto, was afk for a bit, seen better days atm :)
<Bones223> Ah I see, so everyone here is on Haiku as well?
<Bones223> Also I hope your day is nice :)
<phschafft> Bones223: some hot chocolate with your morning cookie then?
<Begasus> Can't tell for everyone, but I'm guessing quite a lot in here are using Haiku (daily or not)
<phschafft> em, I meant you, Begasus. classic tab fail.
<Bones223> phschafft it's all good, probably not used to a new name that starts with a "B", huh?
<Begasus> lol, thanks phschafft! no hot chocalate, but fress coffee serves the cookie well :)
<Bones223> Begasus lol coffee and cookies sounds nice!
<Bones223> Although it's fairly late for me, so such things may be unproductive at this hour >n<
<Begasus> or counter-wise, keeps you going :)
<Bones223> True story! I bet it'll help my learning journey
<Bones223> I'm on a VM right now, but I already like Haiku better than Linux tbh... I just wish I was faster at learning
<Begasus> after +20 years I still stumble on something new in Haiku :D
* phschafft picks his cookie box and offers it's content to both Begasus, and Bones223.
<Begasus> treats for all! :)
<Begasus> and yet another round on llvm ... :)
<Bones223> Lol thank you phschafft!
<Bones223> *Takes a single cookie and eats it*
<Bones223> lol
<Bones223> Idk how to do all this stuff yet, I'll experiment though :D
<Begasus> plenty of things to discover Bones223
<Begasus> first thing to check is the user guide if you stumble into something
<Begasus> and we're around too (for things we know about) :)
<Bones223> Yeah, that's what brought me here, I absolutely love this OS for so many things! I just wish running Windows programs was a little easier, but with practice and time... I'll be a pro!
<Bones223> Thank you Begasus, I appreciate it! I'm learning pretty quickly because this has to be the most intuitive alternative OS I've seen so far
<Begasus> well, there is "almost" all KDE apps around (beside the native ones), so it's hard to say you can't find an app for things you need (not saying everything is out there) :)
<Begasus> quite a bundle of Qt apps ...
<Bones223> True story! Plus, there are countless applications on here already that seem very useful!
<Bones223> I just discovered Poorman that piqued my interests!
<Begasus> right!
<Begasus> small webserver
<Bones223> Incredible! So I can just create a website just like that? With an index.html?
<Begasus> yes, mind you, it doesn't do things like apache or the likes can, so expect basic service
<Begasus> must say I haven't checked that out for a long time though
<Bones223> That's still awesome, I don't like anything other than the most barebones websites TBH. People overcomplicate things
<Bones223> Have you created a website on there yet?
<Begasus> it's not a IDE for websites, so you don't create them, you host them
<Bones223> Ah maybe this is out of my field of understanding, I'm not exactly familiar with all of that
<Begasus> for creating websites I guess Bluefish would be nice
<Bones223> I usually just fiddled around with raw HTML in a regular text editor lol
<Bones223> Notepad++ is my usual go-to for when I get a little more serious, though
<Begasus> same here, editing them with Pe (comes default in Haiku) is fine enough
<Bones223> Yeah, I'm not familiar with Bluefish so maybe it's a good option! Thanks for letting me know
<Begasus> there is "notepadqq" Qt veriant for notepad++
<Bones223> Thanks for letting me know! That's very handy!
<Begasus> ps, for software you can use the gui app "HaikuDepot", or cli with "pkgman"
<Begasus> both have a search function :)
<Bones223> This may be a silly question (especially since I'm already here in the OS) but what kind of programs can I run in Haiku without the HaikuDepot?
<Bones223> Thanks again :D I didn't know about pkgman
<Begasus> "pkgman search notepad" gives some links
<Bones223> Ah I see
<Bones223> I'm glad I found a helpful person like you Begasus
<Begasus> np, here to help (where I can) :) let the real developers to do the actual work :D
<Bones223> That's great! I'll be sure to step in where I can and not bug you guys about every little thing before giving it a good old fashioned college try first
<Bones223> This OS is actually brilliant btw, it feels like something straight out of a movie! If I may ask, Begasus, what got you into Haiku?
<Begasus> BeOS :)
<Bones223> Ah I see, so you've been into computing for quite a while I suppose!
<Begasus> I guess from somewhere earlie 90's
<Bones223> That's wonderful! It's a shame what happened to BeOS... I guess it's not all bad because some brilliant people got together and made Haiku!
<Begasus> and still can't code "hello world!" :P
<Bones223> Haha it's all good, I couldn't code my way out of a wet paper bag
<Begasus> lol
<Bones223> Haha yeah I'm making a video game right now but it's not going super duper well... It's all a part of learning, though! I believe in myself! :D
<Bones223> But I took a little break to learn about alternative Operating Systems
<Begasus> Go for it!
<Bones223> Thanks!
<Begasus> Only thing you probably run into with games is that Haiku doesn't have hardware acceleration
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<Bones223> Yeah I heard about that, very strange but it's no worries :D it'll get there eventually
<Bones223> I mean, we have so many things that weren't there before, and so many people developing it
<Begasus> aside from that, I think we've got about everything in house for development
<Bones223> Yeah it's a very high-functioning OS right out of the bag
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<Bones223> Hey Begasus
<Begasus> wb
<Bones223> Sorry, hit the wrong button and shut down lol
<Bones223> Thank you
<Begasus> thought so :)
<Bones223> Thought I was exiting scaled mode >u<
<Bones223> Did I miss anything?
<Begasus> nope
<Bones223> I'm glad
<Bones223> Yeah, the documentation on Haiku is very good as well! I've never seen anything like it
<Begasus> in the topic channel, there is a link that holds the logs for this channel, you can always read up there
<Bones223> Oh that's really good to know! Thanks again
<Bones223> I'm only a couple hours in, and this OS feels like home. I've customized so much, it's very intuitive
<Bones223> BeOS must've really been something special if people were inspired to make such an impressive piece of software
<Begasus> It was great, in some sense way ahead of compitition
<Begasus> to this day, there are still people running it
<Bones223> That's really impressive!
<Bones223> Well, Begasus, it was super nice meeting you! Hopefully we see lots more of each other! Have a brilliant rest of your day! (I gotta go to sleep lol)
<Begasus> cu next Bones223
<Begasus> have a good night there :)
<Bones223> You too :D
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<Begasus> and ... another round on llvm :)
<Begasus> stupid "waiting for package to ..." :(
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<Calisto> Heyyy
<Calisto> Sorry Begasus... I was suddenly AFK for quite a while xD
<Calisto> Was trying to figure out something with the debugger
<Calisto> getting some sort of a weird crash on the code that I wrote tho I'm not being able to figure out why :(
<Begasus> np Calisto :)
<Calisto> So how's everything going on your end
<Calisto> how was the day :)
<Begasus> aside from the back pain fine as usual :)
<Calisto> oh that's good. I hope the back pain subsides :)
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<Begasus> known issue, keeps me quit for other things :)
<Begasus> quiet? (always miss that one) :)
<Calisto> oh :(
<Calisto> I'm just trying hard to learn this debugger xD
<Calisto> never done assembly before
<Calisto> but trying to learn it :)
<Begasus> for me looking into debugger is like looking at a painting from Picasso :D
<Calisto> xD
<Calisto> feels the same way to me
<Calisto> I have no clue what I'm looking at
<Calisto> and this bug is also kinda weird
<Calisto> it only pops up some times and other times it just doesn't
<Calisto> don't know why and not even being able to figure out why
<Calisto> :(
<zard> Oh, and the Debugger has some bugs. Like sometimes the dissassembly output is incorrect. Makes the art of using the Debugger even more difficult to master.
<Calisto> ohhh
<Calisto> well to be honest I have no clue whether I did something wrong in my code or not
<Calisto> it works sometimes
<Calisto> and it doesn't sometimes
<zard> Sometimes Debugger's breakpoints don't work, or sometimes you want to put a breakpoint in a hard-to-reach spot,
<Calisto> its just to open a simple BFilePanel ... the debugger said its stopping at the BFilePanel::Show() + 0x14 section of the code with the instruction being "mov 0x8(%rdi) %r12"
<Calisto> ohh i see.. right now I was just using the debugger once the program crashed
<Calisto> from that dialog menu
<Calisto> that gives all the options
<zard> Just remember: you can call debugger("") from your code.
<Calisto> yup was just going to try that now
<Calisto> I have like minimal debugging experience from the chrome debugger for JS
<Calisto> no experience with assembly tho
<Calisto> but ill give it a shot
<Calisto> btw zard you work on many sections of the kernel as well right?
<zard> No, you're probably thinking of waddlesplash
<Calisto> ohhh okay
<Calisto> by any chance would you know a thing or two about the PoseView class. I couldn't find much docs on it so was trying to figure out something by reading the code.
<zard> "mov 0x8(%rdi) %r12" <- nothing suspicious about that line of dissassembly, so your dissassembly is more likely to be correct.
<Calisto> oh okay but when Im trying to inspect the memory location %rdi it says that bad memory
<zard> Ah, that explains the crash
<zard> Can't access bad memory so the program crashes
<Calisto> yah it says something like Unable to read address <huge address> and then says Bad Address
<Calisto> but then this error only pops up a few times and its a bit random. Many times, when i was running the program, it worked just fine
<Calisto> is it something that could be going wrong in my code?
<zard> Hmm, I think PoseView has something to do with displaying a folder, but I don't know much about it
<zard> I don't know if something is wrong with your code. Isn't intermittent crashing fun?
<Begasus> heh
<Calisto> I mean I sure am learning something but this thing has been bugging me for quite some time now :(
<zard> If you ever figure out what BPoseView does, it would be nice if you put a (doxygen?) comment above the class
<Calisto> ohhh okay
<Calisto> I get the basic point of it.. and I've been using a specific function that it provides
<Calisto> but its sort of weird
<Calisto> that if I run the function too frequently
<Calisto> the pose view becomes unresponsive
<Calisto> maybe has something to do with threads I think
<Calisto> have to look into it once I figure out this bug
<zard> Maybe due to threads
<Calisto> btw if I put the debugger("") does it pause the program and start the debugger or should I be running it using Debugger ./Tracker
<zard> It makes the program "crash". You can then start the debugger and step through it from there.
<zard> From looking through the functions, it seems like a BPoseView displays a directory listing, whether it is for the desktop, or for Tracker, or for an open file panel
<Calisto> yup.. in my specific panel, it basically opens a BQueryPoseView which just extends the more general BPoseView ... I basically was trying to send a message to this BQueryPoseView to get it to refresh its listings
<Calisto> it does work
<Calisto> but if the messages are sent too quickly it just freezes the panel
<Calisto> even tho it supposedly clears all the previous threads and restarts with new ones
<zard> Ah yes, that's a lovely bug. May take a while till you figure out what is going on
<zard> But when you're done, you'll be slightly more skilled in the black arts of using the Debugger :)
<Calisto> I'm a bit worried about that bug because its pretty close to what I need for my project
<Calisto> at the same time i have very little knowledge about very low level concepts in Operating systems
<zard> Ooh, MiniBrowser is done compiling
* zard gets back to debugging
<zard> Debugging MiniBrowser takes around 10 GB of memory. Good thing I have that much
<zard> Oh, yes, it takes around a full 2 minutes to load as well
<Calisto> oh
<Calisto> wow
<Calisto> that's a lot of memory xD
<Calisto> i'm running my haiku setup on a laptop having only 4Gb of Memory
<zard> Well, I doubt you'll ever need that much, so no worries.
<zard> Browsers seem to be particularly large compared to almost everything else
<Calisto> btw I had a question
<Calisto> how come Haiku doesn't have multiple screen support just yet>?
<zard> Probably because it involves changing a lot of code in multiple different places.
<Calisto> ohhh i see
<zard> Seems like a rather large project at any rate
<Calisto> huh remember that error I was talking about
<Calisto> i guess it was a code error?
<Calisto> i just enclosed my switch case in enclosing brackets
<Calisto> somehow it works now xD
<Calisto> something I should keep in mind I think
<zard> Hmm, strange. Oh well, if it works...
<zard> btw, not all switch cases need to be enclosed in brackets
<Calisto> yahh
<Calisto> that's what is confusing me
<zard> I guess you can straighten that out in code review ;)
<zard> Or look it up, might help too
<Calisto> yup
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<Begasus> bugger, didn't have secondary arch enabled in my profile (in qemu) :P
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1]
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] Begasus 7dadf0c - knetwalk24, revbump, fix app signature, move link to main Deskbar menu (#10593)
<Begasus> I had been using a submenu for the KF6 apps/games here, Deskbar menu a "tad" over-crowded :D
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<Calisto> zard I think I may have gotten the issue
<Calisto> gonna open and close the panel 100 times to try it out xD
<Calisto> I had forgotten to initialize the instance variable in the constructor.. so I'm pretty sure the garbage value was causing the issue
<Begasus> keeping busy :)
<Begasus> nice progress zard!
<Begasus> now I need to run another build for llvm on 32bit :P
<zard> Calisto: yeah, that sounds like something that could cause problems. So it wans't the brases around a switch case?
<Calisto> I'm pretty sure it wasn't
<Calisto> ill try compiling and running without the braces as well
<Calisto> i think it explains the randomness also
<Calisto> since sometimes i think it got the value of NULL while sometimes it didn't
<Calisto> idk
<Calisto> maybe i'm really wrong
<zard> Yeah, I think it could have sometimes gotten NULL and sometimes not
<Calisto> yep
<zard> Hmm, I think there was something to help debug unitialized values...
<zard> From my quick look, the unitialized variable will always be 0xcc with malloc_debug, so no more random behavior
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<zard> bbl
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<Calisto> ohhh
<Calisto> that's actually pretty cool
<Calisto> thanks a lot for that link zard
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev57756] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 7a5148b345ed - HaikuDepot: Remove email
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev57757] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 9631ca73497b - kernel/debug: Report team/thread exit status
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev57758] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 365b32bb6e16 - kernel/team: Set team arguments during load_image/exec_team.
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev57759] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 64981551890d - HaikuDepot: Add rating; escape
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev57760] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 75a70554d91f - HaikuDepot: Pkg name on window
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 3 commits to master [hrev57761] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 1dde4c4b9488 - kernel/smp: change CPUSet::SetBit() and CPUSet::ClearBit() bit order
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] f7a85eea1500 - kernel: add syscalls for thread affinity
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] c5a740cdb23a - gnu: add pthread_setaffinity_np()/pthread_getaffinity_np()
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev57762] -
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 984f843b917a - HaikuBook: document missing BBitmap constructor
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<zard> re
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<phschafft> :)
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<Begasus> k, let's use: -DKDE_INSTALL_QTQCHDIR=$documentationDir/packages/qt6
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<Begasus> going down here, cu peeps!
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<Bones223> Hello everynyan! How are you? Finesankyou
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<Bones223> Hey Begasus[m]
<Bones223> You having a good day?
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<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] korli pushed 1 commit to master [+2/-2/±0]
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] korli 888f378 - gcc: bump to 13.3.0, add recent patches from buildtools repository
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