ChanServ changed the topic of #haiku to: Open-source operating system that specifically targets personal computing. | https://haiku-os.org | Nightlies: https://download.haiku-os.org | Bugtracker: https://dev.haiku-os.org | SCM: https://git.haiku-os.org/ | Logs: https://oftc.irclog.whitequark.org/haiku | Matrix: #haiku:matrix.org | XMPP: #haiku%irc.oftc.net@irc.jabberfr.org
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<Addos> congrats on the new beta!
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<Begasus> g'morning peeps
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<Begasus> g'morning nephele_xmpp
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<nephele_xmpp> Hi begasus
<Begasus> waking up with new release ! :)
<nephele_xmpp> I managed to join just in time for the release yesterday:D
<Begasus> saw waddlesplash doing a first draft on the release PR when stepping in :)
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<nephele_xmpp> 😄
<nephele_xmpp> Having some issues with the xmpp-irc bridge on my mobile client... turns out to be the bridges fault mostly, and it is unmaintained for some time now :/
<nephele_xmpp> Maybe I can improve it
<moparisthebest> biboumi? I'm running my own and here without problems
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<nephele_xmpp> moparisthebest: yes, some problems with xmpp spec violations, and thus problems in monal :)
<moparisthebest> Ah interesting, I only use Android and Linux clients
<Ellenor2000> zrpl
<Ellenor2000> (idk)
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<Forza> Good morning
<Forza> How do I tell if someone has downloaded from my BeShare?
<Begasus> Hi Forza, no idea here
<Forza> :)
<Forza> Not sure anyone would use BeShare instead of official mirrors or torrents though
<Begasus> biab
<Forza> Hm now. My BeShare is not able to connect
<Forza> Ah I see. Haiku didn't renogiate the IP address lease
<Forza> Is that a bug 🐛
<Forza> Somehow I think Web+ isn't exactly correct here.
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<jhj> Hey, I just noticed, Fedora is using wget2, and the next RHEL also uses wget2 as wget, this breaks building Haiku... the scripts use the --retry-on-host-error option to wget, and that option no longer exists in 2.x
<jhj> Probably a good idea to just remove that option...
<Begasus> jhj, that is for building Haiku on Fedora?
<jhj> Yes.
<Begasus> can't you use regular wget then?
<Begasus> would be weird if they removed it
<jhj> That is regular wget now.
<jhj> jhj@hpl ~ $ wget --version
<jhj> GNU Wget2 2.1.0 - multithreaded metalink/file/website downloader
<jhj> That particular flag isn't, actually, documented there at all, but it's not supported in wget 2.x
<Begasus> I see at repology up to 39 it still used 1.* version
<jhj> Begasus: Yes, but 39 is old - it goes EOL on 11/12/2024. 41 is in freeze and 42 in dev now.
<Begasus> maybe an option to build it yourself (wget*) jhj :)
<oanderso[m]> milek7: In the ARM64 exception handler exception vectors, we don't save the FP register file even though it's (mostly) caller-saved in AAPCS64. It seems like that could cause problems, because things like dprintf can use the FP register file, clobbering the original state.
<jhj> Begasus: I could build an older verison of the package and fiddle the paths, but that's kind of silly. I just modified the build/jam/FileRules files to remove the use of that option.
<jhj> Also, other distributions are going to update to wget 2.x eventually - and they'll all break too.
<Begasus> not familiar enough (last build on linux has been too long), but I guess it's just a Fedora thing? maybe others don't need that?
<Begasus> maybe best to open a ticket at the bugtracker then
<jhj> Fedora is the first major linux distribution to update to wget 2.x
<Begasus> we got wget2 for a loooong time also, just not used as default ;)
<jhj> They are no longer developing wget (just bug fixes for awhile) - wget2 is the successor to wget
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<Begasus> I know, started out with the port for wget2 :)
<jhj> Oh good :)
<jhj> Begasus: They changed the the robots-related commands too, which breaks a bunch of scripts.
<jhj> They saved all breaking changes for 2.x it seems.
<Begasus> buggers :P
<oanderso[m]> milek7: We're even calling things like memset/memcpy, which seem very likely to use vector registers
<jhj> Begasus: The other option would be to use curl as a fallback....
<jhj> in actions DownloadLocatedFile1 function, instead of `wget ... -O "$(1)" $(URL) || exit 1` you could do `wget ... -O "$(1)" $(URL) || curl .... "$(1) $(URL) || exit 1` or similar.
<Begasus> jhj, that's up for the main devs :)
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<Forza> I don't understand wget2. It has little in common with the precious version. Might as well use curl then :)
<jhj> I'll file a ticket tomorrow.
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<Begasus> +1
<jhj> Forza: It's a rewrite, yes. wget isn't being developed anymore and apparantly will never support "modern" standards like HTTP2 or QUICK or HTTP compression.
<jhj> *QUIC
<Forza> I know. It's just another download tool at this point
<Forza> It's http/3 now instead of quic :) well it is based on quic so I guess it's the same
<jhj> curl is probably more widely available than wget
<jhj> who knows really
<Forza> Yea because wget2 is not a drop in replacement
<Forza> That's a shame really
<gordonjcp> dovsienko: okay no worries
<gordonjcp> dovsienko: if I find the ones I'm thinking of which are in storage somewhere, I'll send you them anyway
<gordonjcp> dovsienko: they're only going in the skip otherwise
<jhj> wget also doesn't properly support OCSP
<jhj> Where wget2 does.
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<Forza> Yes, no doubt wget2 is a better implementation. Just annoying they decided to not make it drop-in compatible
<jhj> agreed
<jhj> I don't actually mind them breaking the robots stuff, because you aren't supposed to be automating with robots=off anyway, technically speaking.
<jhj> The new commands also make more sense, but it would have been better to support all the old ones too, as least for awhile, maybe in an #ifdef COMPAT1X so they could easily axe them all later.
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<Forza> Yea
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<Begasus> we're taking over!! :D
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<Forza> 👍
<jhj> Forza: Yeah, known. I know IBM is going to move to wget2 in AIX by default soon too in toolbox.
<jhj> Because of security concerns in wget vs. wget2 (insecure FTP support, no OCSP support, etc.)
<oanderso[m]> milek7: I think we should unconditionally save the FP state like x86 appears to do: https://github.com/haiku/haiku/blob/c936122410bc6e704c35de5267e3a34f5450d366/src/system/kernel/arch/x86/64/interrupts.S#L282
<Forza> Oscp enabled was mentioned as a privacy issue in that ticket
<jhj> That was fixed awhile back - https://gitlab.com/gnuwget/wget2/-/issues/664
<jhj> It doesn't do OCSP requests by default now, but not supporting OCSP at all is becoming a problem if there is a "corporate policy" on such things.
<jhj> PCI-DSS recommends OCSP over just CRLs for example.
<Begasus> bbl
<jhj> thx, later
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* nephele_xmpp waves
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<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] korli pushed 1 commit to master [+1/-0/±1] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/564b7d032f45...f95bc48dd999
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] korli f95bc48 - liblayout: fix header guards to prefix with LAYOUT
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] korli pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/f95bc48dd999...fba38d7734d3
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] korli fba38d7 - beam: rebuild
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<HaikuUser> hi
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<waddlesplash> anybody notice a news article about R1/beta5, tell one of the devs so we can add it to https://dev.haiku-os.org/wiki/R1/Beta5/InThePress
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<san2ban> Hi---Beam working now, after a long time...but, we cannot delete unwanted emails. an error pops up....says " "..that is all, nothing else..how to delete emails?..
<san2ban> I am unableto see old chats...But on Voidlinux, using hexchat, old chats, i.e previous day's, are still displayed
<dovsienko> hexchat saves a local copy of each channel messages to some extent (1000 lines or some such), so that's what you see when you start it
<dovsienko> other clients may or may not have the same feature. this is still not a feature of IRC, as far as I know
<san2ban> thanks dovsienko....do not remember having seen you on the forums....
<dovsienko> I prefer mailing lists and IRC
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<OscarL> san2ban: you can use the IRC logs, if you need them: https://oftc.irclog.whitequark.org/haiku/
<san2ban> OscarL, thanks..will check
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<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] pulkomandy pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±2] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/fba38d7734d3...dbf8105eb8a0
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] pulkomandy dbf8105 - apache httpd: some fixes
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<nephele_xmpp> So far each time I did someone beat me to it ;)
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<phschafft> ?
<OscarL> ¿
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<phschafft> ⸘
<OscarL> opening interrobang? First time I see it :-)
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<phschafft> everyday something new in #haiku.
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<Begasus> re
<Forza> ((̲̅ ̲̅(̲̅H̲̅a̲̅i̲̅k̲̅u̲̅( ̲̅((>
<Forza> Let's all write new fun Haiku :D
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<Forza> ~(‾▿‾)~
<Begasus> let's try this KDE frameworks update :)
<Forza> To build or install?
<Begasus> first build
<Begasus> got a script that takes care of that :) (old one still in the haikuports repo, just bumped to todays changes) :)
<Begasus> 2024-09-14 18:05:47 (1.81 MB/s) - ‘/Opslag/haikuports/kde-frameworks/breeze-icons/download/breeze-icons-6.6.0.tar.xz’ saved [2248988/2248988]
<Begasus> k, patch for that still good also :)
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<Forza> Nice. Quite impressive how well Haiku works nowadays
<Forza> And many supported softwares
<Begasus> all kudos laying the groundwork :)
<Begasus> kudos to those*
<Begasus> 12 out of 71 done ... crossing fingers
<OscarL> Python's test suite always being a PITA with something... now test_readline hangs for 3.12... but only when you launch it along with the rest of the tests. Run it alone? Fails, but doesn't hangs :-/
<Begasus> hi OscarL, back at python?
<OscarL> Begasus: hey there, Yeah, I missied the RC2 for 3.13, and seems there where releases for all version from 3.9 and up last week.
<OscarL> Had a branch for 3.12.5 I was fixing stuff on... just updated it to 3.12.6. Will open a PR once I update the test results.
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<OscarL> test_json either takes almost 5 minutes, or fails immediatly. Sigh.
<Begasus> heh, know the feeling, only did dolphin 24.08.0 yesterday and later saw that gear 24.08.1 was released :P
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<Begasus> biab
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<HaikuUser> hello
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<humdinger> hullo
<OscarL> hey there.
<OscarL> Why oh, why pkgman insists in trying to install openssl3_man ?!?!?
<humdinger> because openssl3_woman demands it?
<OscarL> mmm, only does so when using "pkgman install -H <some unrelated package>" :-/
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<OscarL> something is broken with the package resolution. openssl3_man is not required by anything, only "supplements" openssl3.
<OscarL> me and my luck finding weird bugs :-(
<humdinger> someone has to :)
<humdinger> we all benefit from your unlucky sacrifice.
<OscarL> heh :-)
<OscarL> too bad that always happens when I'm trying to focus in fixing something else :-)
<OscarL> Ok. At least this speedtest_cli patch I stole works as intended.
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<Begasus> hi humdinger
<Begasus> OscarL, if it supplements it it's not a bug, it's a feature :P
<OscarL> oh, c'mon! now nano makes some chars invisible while I'm trying to write a commit message :-(
<humdinger> huhu
<Begasus> now that's a weird bug :)
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<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] humdingerb pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://github.com/haikuports/haikuports/compare/dbf8105eb8a0...55cc7e30f9ab
<botifico> [haikuports/haikuports] humdingerb 55cc7e3 - Genio: improved description formatting
<humdinger> I figured Genio package is just over 2 MiB, not too much for people having to update.
<OscarL> I'd like it a bit better if clangd was optional for it.
<humdinger> And I forgot to update the text of the Welcome page, "This is our 8th public release." should be 9th...
<humdinger> I've now removed that part.
<OscarL> (but that's why I download it, unpack it, change the .PackageInfo file, and package it again)
<humdinger> That's smething the Genio has to decide on.
<OscarL> sure.
<humdinger> *Genio team
<Begasus> typos rubbing off?
* humdinger glares at OscarL :P
<OscarL> I'm *not* that contagious!
<Begasus> I tend to disagree :P
<OscarL> :-P
<OscarL> Begasus: do you have openssl3_man installed?
<Begasus> OscarL, every one should afaik, as it supplements the main package
<OscarL> "_man"... only has the man pages, it is not required.
<Begasus> only weird thing to me would be that why it isn't included in the main package
<Begasus> mostly manpages are bundled with the binaries
<OscarL> no idea, but would you mind doing a quick test for me?
<Begasus> well, uninnstalling didn't seem to bring the system down
<Begasus> depends, got the KDE framework bulk build running atm
<OscarL> Mind uninstalling it, and attempt to install some package, but with "pkgman install -H" and see if pkgman wants to install back openssl3_man?
<OscarL> (I tested with "pkgman install -H speedtest_cli" for example)
<OscarL> welp... with a local .hpkg file for it.
<Begasus> yep, does the same here
<OscarL> lol. Thanks Begasus.
<Begasus> np, happy to help oud D
<OscarL> at least it is not just my cursed install.
<Begasus> what does "-H" do?
<Begasus> it's not mentioned in "pkgman -h"
<humdinger> pkgman install --help
<humdinger> "Install the packages in the user's home directory."
<Begasus> ah right
<OscarL> Begasus: I try to use that when I can (or when I remember), to avoid getting that "name in use" error when "updating" to a version that's the same I've just compiled/tested.
<OscarL> number of seeders for the beta5 isos: 97 for the 64 bits, 36 for the 32 bits one.
<OscarL> used to be closer to 2 to 1 ratio for previous betas.
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<nipos> Are there a lot of people who actually use torrents to download Haiku?
<OscarL> I did.
<B2IA> (AGMS) I see a few downloads each month, even for older Haiku.
<OscarL> but basically just from the webseed, as I was an early bird.
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<nipos> I really like Torrents,but I suspect 99% just use the HTTPS mirrors because it's easier.I have some servers that are currently quite bored and could be used for seeding,if there's need for it.
<Begasus> I also did, but only to seed, as I'm already on R1B5 before the release :P
<OscarL> yea, same here.
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<B2IA> (AGMS) Hmmm, I should try upgrading the BeShare to IRC bridge to use Haiku R1B5...
<nipos> I already tried seeding with my desktop PC,but it uploaded only 200kb before Transmission crashed.It crashes every few minutes,it seems
<OscarL> 99 seeds now. I think max I saw for beta4 was around 190.
<jhj> Interesting ... on my system if I try pkgman full-sync I get:
<jhj> upgrade package flac13-1.3.4-2 to 1.3.4-2 from repository HaikuPorts
<jhj> which fails because "Name in use"
<OscarL> jhj: usually that happens to me for packages that I build locally.
<OscarL> thus why I try to install them with "pkgman install -H <package>" (when I remember to do so).
<OscarL> if you haven't built flac13... you should probably file a ticket :-)
<jhj> Nope, never manually built it here
<jhj> I'll add that to my list and file it when I have more time
<jhj> I'm just trying to break stuff, dont mind me :)
<Begasus> flac13 should be obsolete, think I told you already jhj?
<Begasus> can you try to "uninstall" it?
<OscarL> weird that he gets the "name in use" error either way.
<jhj> uninstalling it was fine, nothing was using it.
<Begasus> yeah, flac13 isn't something one would build itself
<Begasus> and lib only atm untill full removal
<Begasus> about 30 packages to go ...
<FreeFull> I wonder how many people still use slashdo
<FreeFull> slashdot
<nosycat> Got a friend who still reads it regularly.
<nosycat> And often shares good stuff from there.
<nosycat> It's kinda weird to me to see FLTK listed as a new port.
* augiedoggie_ thinks emacs should've been listed because it has more users than fltk :P
<augiedoggie_> getting slashdotted is tradition, i think we've made the front page for every release
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<nosycat> Cool. See you!
<nipos> Someone in the Slashdot comments noticed that https://www.haiku-os.org/about/movies still links to haiku-files.org in many places,and that redirects to some scam site.
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<nipos> Ah yes,I love that site...
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<OscarL> :-(
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<x512[m]> DoS protection I suppose.
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<nipos> Protects them from actual users as well, but fine, I'm not going to change anything on the website anyways. Only wanted to say that it probably should be done by someone, to avoid linking to some redirect scam.
<OscarL> PulkoMandy did some changes related to that a while ago, but seems more remains to be done. nipos, maybe add a note here? https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/18878
<PulkoMandy> I could only fix one video. For the other ones github complained that the files were too large
<Begasus> closing down here
<Begasus> cu peeps!
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<PulkoMandy> I think ryan and axel are trying to recover access to the dreamhost account and a new url will be set up?
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<nipos> Yes, looks like the plan is to bring it back online at files.haiku-os.org, which makes sense to me. Last activity on the ticket was 27 hours ago. I don't think I need to add additional noise there.
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<gordonjcp> PulkoMandy: let me know if you need space to put stuff, I have shitloads
<gordonjcp> PulkoMandy: also re video, let me know if you need space to put stuff, I have shitloads
<nipos> Same here, I have two big and two medium servers with lots of free space and unmetered traffic
<gordonjcp> nipos: :-)
<gordonjcp> I only have one, on Hetzner in Finland
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<gordonjcp> it's metered traffic I *think*, I've never even come near it though
<nipos> Two at Hetzner in Germany and two at Contabo in Germany
<gordonjcp> nice
<gordonjcp> how are Contabo?
<gordonjcp> nipos: I run MediaCMS on mine which is pretty awesome
<nipos> The Contabo servers ran Matrix Synapse until a few months ago, now they're completely empty and wait for the contracts to run out. Still a few months to go, but I can still cancel the quit if I have new use for them
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<nipos> Contabo is good. They offer much fast SSD storage at low prices. Exactly what you need for the ever-growing Matrix databases. Their support is terrible, but if you don't need it, the servers are technically good.
<x512[m]> PulkoMandy: Why separate domain was used in first place? Why not use subdomain?
<gordonjcp> their prices are good actually
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<gordonjcp> nipos: their VPS prices are incredible
<nipos> Yes
<nipos> And the dedicated servers are overpriced. For dedicated, Hetzner is cheaper.
<gordonjcp> nipos: I found with Hetzner when I actually needed to talk to support suddenly everyone only spoke German
<gordonjcp> aber für mich, das ist nicht so schlech
<gordonjcp> *schlecht
<nipos> Well, they're a German company, so that's to be expected
<x512[m]> PulkoMandy: HaikuPorter also still generate a reference to haiku-files.org for source package mirrors.
<gordonjcp> ich spreche ein bisschen aber genug Deutsche, und mein Frau ist Osterriecher
<gordonjcp> so
<gordonjcp> it works just fine for me
<nipos> I'm German and live in Germany, so no issue speaking in German to the Hetzner guys :)
<gordonjcp> you could hear them absolutely fuming that they couldn't get away with "sorry can't understand you laalaalaa"
<PulkoMandy> x512[m]: Please direct your complaints to the people who decided to let haiku-files.org expire and did not set up a replacement (it is not me)
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* OscarL could understand that "aber für mich, das ist nicht schlecht"... mmm... how?
<PulkoMandy> gordonjcp: Storage space is not a problem: the server is still online and I also have a mirror on beosarchives
<gordonjcp> nipos: I've been learning it slowlyish over the past six years we've been together
<x512[m]> I do not know who, but Pulkomandy is a member of official developers.
<gordonjcp> OscarL: I may not have said that very clearly :-)
<gordonjcp> OscarL: I have enough German to get by in Vienna with ordering food, buying shoes, getting trains and stuff
<gordonjcp> OscarL: and as it turns out, enough to get Hetzner to stop moaning and actually fix my shit
<OscarL> :-)
<gordonjcp> tell you what
<gordonjcp> I don't know if other German-speaking places are like this
<gordonjcp> I found in Vienna if you at least try to start off in German suddenly everyone knows enough English to at least meet you in the middle
<OscarL> gordonjcp: just in case, I was puzzled, because I don't know any word in German :-)
<gordonjcp> the guy SHOUTING - VERY - SLOWLY - IN - ENGLISH gets bugger all
<gordonjcp> me, I get the big freshly-cooked schnitzel on my roll
<gordonjcp> \o/
<OscarL> :-)
<dovsienko> I tried both Contabo and Hetzner
<nipos> Speaking of languages, I wonder why there is no German Haiku channel yet, while so many community members are German and there are channels in so many other languages...
<gordonjcp> that is strange
<nipos> That came to my mind yesterday, when I found https://www.haiku-os.org/community/irc accidentally, but it fits to the topic now
<dovsienko> they work fine until they don't, so neither is outstanding. you do find other competitors with similar pricing, or higher monthly transfer, or more professional tech support
<gordonjcp> I idle in a couple of -de channels just to get exposure to another language
<nipos> I'm not in a lot of chats anymore, it costs too much time. Only here and the OpenIndiana channel. But a German Haiku chat is something I'd like to see, additionally to this one.
<OscarL> jeeez, KDL in VBox eats my 4 Phenom II cores for breakfast :-(
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<PulkoMandy> x512[m]: Domain names are in the hands of either sysadmins or haiku inc. So, not me. You can see in the ticket linked earlier that I am as annoyed as you, and I can do nothing
<x512[m]> Should I create a ticket for HaikuPorter?
<PulkoMandy> Yes, there doesn't seem to be one already
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<HaikuUser> hi
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<OscarL> Hello HaikuUser.
<HaikuUser> i am running it from vmware
<HaikuUser> after trying templeos
<OscarL> :-)
<HaikuUser> can you tell how to quickly make a hello world gui application in here
<OscarL> (RIP Terry)
<HaikuUser> rip
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<OscarL> so little patience...
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<Forza> PulkoMandy: if you want and it's something people want, i could host the haiku-files stuff. You mentioned 14G stuff. No biggie to host on a vps for me.
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<PulkoMandy> Forza: Again, it is not a hosting problem, the server is still online if you know its ip address, and I have made a mirror. It is just a domain name configuration problem
<PulkoMandy> We have free hosting provided by dreamhost for many years, and no reason to stop using that
<Forza> I see. Just read the ticket and that you're trying to get it pointed back to the dreamhost again.
<Forza> :) i hope it works out. If not my offer stands :)
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<KSPAtlas[m]> Is there a known fix for the broken resolutions in libvirt QEMU? VGA and QXL are locked at 2048x2048, and virtio displays more options, but selecting them causes an unknown mode error
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<waddlesplash> KSPAtlas[m]: try with VESA maybe? I think virtio vga support is still experimental for haiku