ChanServ changed the topic of #haiku to: Open-source operating system that specifically targets personal computing. | https://haiku-os.org | Nightlies: https://download.haiku-os.org | Bugtracker: https://dev.haiku-os.org | SCM: https://git.haiku-os.org/ | Logs: https://oftc.irclog.whitequark.org/haiku | Matrix: #haiku:matrix.org | XMPP: #haiku%irc.oftc.net@irc.jabberfr.org
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* waddlesplash was reminded of some of the more interesting kernel bugfixes he's investigated over the past few years
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<zdykstra> That's a fun one. How did you end up diagnosing that?
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<waddlesplash> zdykstra: the linked ticket has a lot of the details
<waddlesplash> or well, some of the details. somewhere along the way I made an intelligent guess about what was happening and added some ASSERTs to try and catch it: https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=8dae411c1efbf28fbd76c3ed0db66ffec475f2dc
<waddlesplash> and the ASSERTs indeed tripped, and I went from there
<jessicah> waddlesplash: hmm, I should enable KDEBUG then for my GHC builds
<jessicah> err, a KDEBUG enabled Haiku, for my GHC builds
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<jessicah> as GHC gets tripped up by unlocking a mutex by the wrong thread... but I dunno if these will help to diagnose
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<jessicah> oh, KDEBUG is always enabled? hmm
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<exit70> quassel still shows freenode a lot :(
<waddlesplash> jessicah: we disable it in release branches
<waddlesplash> jessicah: a KDL or a userland debugger trip? if the former I'm extremely interested, open a ticket pls
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<jessicah> no, it's userland issue
<jessicah> problem with pthreads
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<e1z0> yo
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<Anarchos> is it safe to change the wifi network while wget is downloading ?
<Anarchos> waddlesplash congratulations for your hiring !!
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<Anarchos> is there someone alive ?
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<Coldfirex> I hope so
<mmu_man> still not sure :p
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<countryboy> hi, everybody needs somebody to love xD
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<yann64[m]> Anarchos: tried it once a few years back, it did not go well but I can't remember if it was due to wget being unable to resume the download
<yann64[m]> or something else
<yann64[m]> but again it was several years ago, would need to test again
<yann64[m]> and yes I am alive, but I guess like many I am connected but only coming back to check messages at coffee breaks :)
<rennj> downloader-for-x and uget, when wget/curl fail. but its rare failure
<rennj> aria2 bloat might be worth checking out
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<rennj> 3days to download 700MB on 56K modem yeah who has time for failures.
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<Anarchos> yann64[m] i will let it finish then, only 25min left to download the 3.2Gb archive of texlive...
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<Anarchos> which tool is the best to construct GUI ?
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<Anarchos> Is bebuilder still relevant ?
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<mrentropyvcs> I never tried BeBuilder. I tried ALE, but it only crashed.
<yann64[m]> Anarchos: It works I do not think it supports the layout API, hence you GUI will not scale gracefully
<yann64[m]> I am not aware of any GUI tool supporting the layout API
<skirst> Qt5 seems well enough supported, if you don't mind staying strictly native
<waddlesplash> so people may have missed it since commit notifications don't seem to be posted here for some reason
<waddlesplash> but ... jscipione's work to add thumbnail support to Tracker was merged a few hours ago
<augiedoggie_> heh, "some reason"
<waddlesplash> augiedoggie_: it used to work, guess it broke during some round of migration
<augiedoggie_> yeah, that's why i commented on that commit a while back, irker was disabled without a replacement in place
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<mrentropyvcs> \O/ Thumbnails!
<yann64[m]> well, I thought that for projects with lots of contributors, IRC notification is not ideal as it makes a lot of noise within the channel.
<yann64[m]> Haiku does not have this issue for now but there is hope it will change :)
<countryboy> .023
<countryboy> ops
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<yann64[m]> Personally I prefer browsing the cgit log, I know I will not miss something
<Anarchos> waddlesplash congrats for your hiring !!
<waddlesplash> thnx :)
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<nekobot> [haiku/buildtools] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [btrev43169] - https://git.haiku-os.org/buildtools/log/?qt=range&q=145681298897+%5E2f8f3a16b79e
<nekobot> [haiku/buildtools] 145681298897 - buildtools: Remove build warnings which are caused by missing return type declarations.
<kallisti5[m]> a new bot is inbound.. expect a little spam while I tune it
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<nekobot> test haiku
<nekobot> test everybody
<Anarchos> dropping a big chunk of text into Terminal makes it freeze
<countryboy> Anarchos: also fpide dosn't work in Terminal ...
<Anarchos> countryboy what is fpide ?
<countryboy> Anarchos: free pascal ide
<Anarchos> countryboy i don't program in pascal anymore , since 1994 :)
<countryboy> it is funny, styled ...
<countryboy> a love basic and pascal ...
<Not-5726> [haiku/infrastructure] kallisti5 pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgTm
<Not-5726> [haiku/infrastructure] kallisti5 8d0c218 - irccat: Join to haiku as well
* Anarchos just needs texlive to be installed again to program with noweb :)
<Anarchos> by the way, why dropping some kb of text in Terminal makes it freeze ??
<countryboy> ... i love : basic and pascal ...
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<countryboy> and bepascal is from mmuman ?
<Not-5726> [haiku/infrastructure] kallisti5 pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgkq
<Not-5726> [haiku/infrastructure] kallisti5 5996d3a - gerrit/hook: notify channels specified in repo git config
<countryboy> pascal + haiku libs as units ?
<kallisti5[m]> ok. Haiku, buildtools commits should show up here now too
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55350] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=1764036b158e+%5Ea5061ecec553
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 1764036b158e - Preferences/Time: Remove 32-bit UNIX time checks.
<waddlesplash> hey it works
<kallisti5[m]> hey. I'm competent! :-D
<kallisti5[m]> those notifications look a lot prettier in irssi vs matrix :-\
<countryboy> what is matrix ?
<kallisti5[m]> The irc channels are bridged to matrix (another chat system)
<countryboy> ok
<countryboy> freedom
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<kallisti5[m]> tldr; anyone with an [m] is chatting via matrix
<kallisti5> not matrix
<kallisti5[m]> matrix
<kallisti5[m]> this looks awesome in matrix
<countryboy> horgasm ... better than porn ...
<countryboy> printed pcl5 printer test page ...
<countryboy> xD
<kallisti5> nice! i didn't know our printer stuff worked
<countryboy> usb + pcl5
<countryboy> brother hl 1210 laser printer ...
<mrentropyvcs> I need network printing. I also need a new printer.
<mrentropyvcs> Question: Getting around to writing a bug (or searching for similar). Issue is: Atari Modern controller (USB) sends Haiku to KDL when used with MAME. Does not go KDL when used with Retroarch.
<mrentropyvcs> Would that be an OS bug (KDL), or MAME/SDL bug? Or both?
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<Anarchos[m]> not matrix :)
<waddlesplash> mrentropyvcs: all KDLs are OS bugs
<waddlesplash> userland apps should never be able to cause a KDL
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<waddlesplash> well, unless you triggered one manually via "/bin/kernel_debugger" :P
<mrentropyvcs> waddlesplash: Cool. Thanks! Then I will try and get that done today. It is a "Divide Error Exception"
<waddlesplash> oh ... it's probably a dupe of https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/16794
<waddlesplash> I need to investigate that for real
<Anarchos> how to find the size limit for a drag/drop text into terminal ?
<mrentropyvcs> It does sound about the same.
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<mrentropyvcs> You'd think I'd learn...
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<julicenri> Just heard that Tracker got large thumbnail support (Icon view).
<julicenri> Very nice, now Tracker is more advanced than Nautilus and the GTK file picker.
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55351] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=6211ae257544+%5E1764036b158e
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 6211ae257544 - BBitmap: Remove BeOS tweak to fix Spirograph 1.5
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<waddlesplash> julicenri: wait, really? :O
<julicenri> Yep, congrats!
<julicenri> :D
<waddlesplash> runtime_loader: Cannot open file libzstd.so.1: No such file or directory
<waddlesplash> so ... @minimum-raw builds are just broken and nobody noticed? :|
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<BrunoSpr> waddlesplash: Yes look at the git page
<waddlesplash> no, they build, they just don't run
<waddlesplash> looks like the package_infos are wrong
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<BrunoSpr> waddlesplash... So there is work for you left then?
<BrunoSpr> Anyway we can expect the thumbnail supprort to work soon I hope...
<julicenri> waddlesplash: Correction, it's just the GTK file picker than doesn't have large thumbnails. Still, Haiku's Tracker has advanced past that.
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<waddlesplash> BrunoSpr: it should be available in updates already
<BrunoSpr> Yes, I am very exited to test and use it... is Haiku close to get really famous this year?
<BrunoSpr> I would be happy with a TrackerAddOn to show the pictures in a folder, thats maybe easier to program? Just a thought.
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<jadedctrl> oo, i'm excited to update tonight
<Anarchos> jadedctrl i too
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<Anarchos> what to do when terminal freezes, but i don't want to kill runinng processes launched from within the terminal ?
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<B2IA> Anarchos, leave it be, start another Terminal window.
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<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgHf
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh d7d563c - Add arm arm64 and riscv64 to bash recipe
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<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgH5
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 7d73734 - Add arm64 riscv64 to freetype recipe
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<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports.cross] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+1/-0/±0] https://git.io/JEgdf
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports.cross] X547 faa8f7d - binutils_bootstrap: add recipe based on buildtools source
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 2 commits to master [hrev55352] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=e3acf8917ba5+%5E6211ae257544
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] ece327f1066f - Overhaul "haiku" PackageInfo.
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] e3acf8917ba5 - Fix usage of Zstd build feature.
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55353] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=822ee1243acc+%5Ee3acf8917ba5
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 822ee1243acc - fs_shell: Detect 64-bit by comparing LONG_MAX and INT_MAX.
<countryboy> long 64 ... int 32 ?
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55354] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=f7e7bce8e1d5+%5E822ee1243acc
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] f7e7bce8e1d5 - Tracker: Truncate long file names in middle
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgbk
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 9cab1ff - [Hack] Add riscv64 and arm64 to gcc recipe
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<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgb6
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 2602f00 - Add arm64 and riscv64 to libsolv, enable arm
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgbF
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 8b1e40f - Add arm64 and riscv64 to zlib recipe
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55355] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=6bb8ecb02bb5+%5Ef7e7bce8e1d5
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 6bb8ecb02bb5 - package_infos/generic: Remove ">= 66" from ICU.
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgNY
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh f665cfd - Add arm arm64 and riscv64 to readline recipe
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<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgNM
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh c295fe7 - Add arm64 riscv64 to ncurses recipe
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<skirst> still new here, and do not know the policy on swearing, but the haiku installer is pretty fucking rad.
<tqh> If we reduce what we install as mandatory it could be faster.
<skirst> i just love that i can clone my installs willy nilly right off the boot
<tqh> yes, it's a very nice feature.
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgxJ
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 5e16a48 - Add arm64 riscv64 to gettext recipe
<waddlesplash> skirst: we keep it PG-13 at absolute most in here
<waddlesplash> if that answers your question
<waddlesplash> but yes, Installer is indeed pretty rad.
<waddlesplash> and welcome :)
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<skirst> waddlesplash: noted. i'll hold my p's and q's
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgxC
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh a407d1f - Add arm64 riscv64 to libiconv recipe
<skirst> waddlesplash: and thank you
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JEgx1
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh e231936 - Add arm64 riscv64 and enable arm for bison recipe
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<waddlesplash> Dusan_Krehel: 1. exact same setup for both Linux and Haiku I presume (i.e. bare metal?) 2. 64 or 32 bit? 3. what is the "x" in the second?
<waddlesplash> 21699 vs. 26691 is not 81x slower
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] korli pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55356] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=147b47e08654+%5E6bb8ecb02bb5
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 147b47e08654 - Translators: Add an AVIF translator
<waddlesplash> Dusan_Krehel: also your micro_time is ... very strange, why not just use timeval directly...?
<Dusan_Krehel> Dusan_Krehel updated https://krehel.sk/the-slow-work-with-memory-in-haiku/ about type of ISO Haiku.
<Dusan_Krehel> waddlesplash: 1) real maxchine
<Dusan_Krehel> real hardware, none virtualisation
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<Dusan_Krehel> ex. 5 x => 5 times slower as in Linux
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<waddlesplash> this sounds like something is going seriously wrong on your machine, these numbers are not at all typical
<waddlesplash> is something taking up a lot of CPU?
<waddlesplash> Dusan_Krehel: on my extremely slow VM, I get, e.g.
<waddlesplash> 0.119965 s - test_alloc_memory
<waddlesplash> 0.195815 s - test_alloc_memory_and_set
<waddlesplash> (32bit, and again, this VM is really slow)
<dr_evil_> perhaps MTRR setup wrong?
* Dusan_Krehel uploaded (New <h3>Type of hardware</h3>).
<Coldfirex> Methyltetrahydrofolate-Homocysteine Methyltransferase Reductase? :)
<Dusan_Krehel> waddlesplash: i used real hardware, none virtualization.
<waddlesplash> any anomalies with CPU usage on Haiku?
<Dusan_Krehel> waddlesplash: in Linux, FreeBDS, OpenBSD and Linux is none problem
<waddlesplash> yes, there's some issue for sure, but what it is is another matter
<waddlesplash> often on laptops, ACPI eats tons of CPU usage
<dr_evil_> btw, I don't like the #ifndef COUNT
<dr_evil_> is it possible that haiku already has defined COUNT to something huge?
<dr_evil_> also, depending on compiler switches, memcpy might be implemented by the compiler or by the OS
<beaglejoe> waddlesplash: "so ... @minimum-raw builds are just broken and nobody noticed?" Please close ticket 17067 :)
<Dusan_Krehel> U look: Tests found a error(s) . I disable all optimization. But Haiku is slower.
<Dusan_Krehel> dr_evil_: as u
<tqh> waddlesplash, untrue. It is only on Lenovo laptops that needs a special embedded controller as they decided to go their own way.
<tqh> So on lenovo the embedded controller just spins forever.
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<Dusan_Krehel> i compiled test with: gcc test.c -o test -O0 -fPIC -flto -march=x86-64 -std=gnu99 -DIMPORT_RECORDS=$count -DTIME_IMPORT_TO_MEMORY
<dr_evil_> -fno-builtin can be used to force the compiler to use memcpy from the OS library (I don't think that matters much, just FYI)
<waddlesplash> beaglejoe: lol! thanks for noticing :)
<beaglejoe> waddlesplash: np
<dr_evil_> however, I don't understand the "slower" markings
<waddlesplash> Dusan_Krehel: yes, but seeing as the problem does not seem to happen for most of us, the problem appears to be somehow specific to your hardware
<waddlesplash> likely a bug in Haiku nonetheless if other OSes handle it, but it will be harder to diagnose
<dr_evil_> 21699 26691 81x slower
<Dusan_Krehel> sorry
<Coldfirex> "21699 26691 81x slower" I still dont understand that. Its not 81x slower
<dr_evil_> why is that 81x wehen it is really 1.23x
<dr_evil_> also, Linux is slower, not Haiku
<waddlesplash> huh, how about it
<waddlesplash> two of the tests Haiku is indeed slower but it is faster on the others
<waddlesplash> makes the first cases all the more mysterious
<dr_evil_> yes, random, 10, 100 and 1000B seem to be faster on haiku
* Dusan_Krehel section Tests found a error(s) is right
<Dusan_Krehel> u use reload page
<dr_evil_> yes I agree that those 2 memory alloc are slower
<Dusan_Krehel> dr_evil_: 10 is slower, because the function call has a great cut
<Dusan_Krehel> is a error in my computer?
<Dusan_Krehel> as file:///home/dusan/krehel.sk/the-slow-work-with-memory-in-haiku/index.html
<Dusan_Krehel> as krehel.sk/the-slow-work-with-memory-in-haiku/
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<dr_evil_> yes, Statistic for array seem to be awfully slow, agreed
<Dusan_Krehel> linux is +- slower, because Linux kernel have more code lines
<waddlesplash> probably not, with something so simple, kernel matters not so much
<waddlesplash> this is largely a page fault / allocator benchmark
<Coldfirex> speaking of were we still wanting to move to the musl mallow(?) ones its ready?
<Coldfirex> *malloc
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<BrunoSpr> Hi all... Haiku cannot play DRM protected media, is it?
<tqh> our random generator is just mersenne twister, while linux probably adds entropy and things
<BrunoSpr> Should be converted first? Did not try for a long time... but I remember there is a way
<Dusan_Krehel> another, i dont use none random dates
<Dusan_Krehel> in real test are dates from files (one random file for tests)
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<Animortis> Wowow Haiku looking good under Qemu today. Huge improvement over the past few weeks.
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 30 commits to master [+0/-0/±31] https://git.io/JE2kA
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 34082d6 - Add arm arm64 riscv64 for libzlib recipe
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh 195c648 - Add arm64 riscv64 for patch recipe
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh eaf31df - Add arm64 riscv64 for bzip2 recipe
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] ... and 27 more commits.
<Animortis> This virtualized machine is like my dream device. Omg. Can't wait til it works this well on bare metal.
<Coldfirex> arm and riscv64 for everything today
<rennj> 54billion nvidia purchase
<rennj> hmm 40billion...for arm
<rennj> riscv64 is way to go
<rennj> https://blog.pimaker.at/texts/rvc1/ Linux in a Pixel Shader - A RISC-V Emulator for VRChat
<rennj> crazy!
<rennj> isnt all the Raspberry Pi foobar just a broadcom play
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<rennj> nvidia gets hold of arm, and it will be events.gfe.nvidia.com telemetry all over again...analytic/data broker..they cant help themselves
<rennj> when your video card or RGB mouse do telemetry on you..screw that..
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<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] https://git.io/JE2mY
<Not-5726> [haikuports/haikuports] tqh bf5f9a8 - Added arm64 riscv64 enabled arm for gawk recipe
* waddlesplash is going to attempt to smash this into the Haiku kernel
<rennj> (co-authored with Keith Packard) mr x windows
<Coldfirex> looks like a nice project
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<waddlesplash> but first I'm going to update ubsan
<Dusan_Krehel> iok, so in linux during QUEMU or what install Haiku, both a problem as on real hardware https://krehel.sk/the-slow-work-with-memory-in-haiku/
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<Dusan_Krehel> next day, i try test on another metal
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<Coldfirex> Dusan: thanks for looking into. Once there is some good data collected we might want to create a bug report to see what if anything can be done to improve the situation
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<Skipp_OSX> tracker thumbnail icons got in today woo
<Dusan_Krehel> Coldfirex: ok. Contact one me is on krehel.sk
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<Dusan_Krehel> sorry, now is right version of https://krehel.sk/the-slow-work-with-memory-in-haiku/
<waddlesplash> I'm not surprised our malloc is slower, it's rather old
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<mmu_man> we changed it like 3 times in 10 years already :p
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<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 2 commits to master [hrev55357] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=9c91c3b5a28d+%5E147b47e08654
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 3ca830e36458 - kernel/team: Adjust address_space assignment slightly.
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] 9c91c3b5a28d - kernel: Adjust timeout computation for syscall_restart.
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] waddlesplash pushed 1 commit to master [hrev55358] - https://git.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=f27a660a6acc+%5E9c91c3b5a28d
<nekobot> [haiku/haiku] f27a660a6acc - kernel: Style fixup.
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